Newguy

it looks like C is labled L on fig 8 into fig 7

Has anyone found wer connections K10,K11,K3,K3 from the FG go?

its actually a resonate circuit when you tune it like this or a form of amplitude modulation.Ive added fig 3,4,6,12 with the 8XA cell driver part.... check out the increase in amplitude on the frequency generator im try in to fix 3 and 4 now if you wanna have a go at it..... i dont know if the values on 3 and 4 are rite, Im searching now where those connections go  ... the K10,K11,K3,K3.The sim shows it better if you unhook the scope leads and watch as you one at a time to each of the frequencies.I dont have my cell yet... old got trashed but.... i think the capacitor will act like a filter and without the frequencies adding like that in the sim on the FG then the resonace kills out rite.... just a thawt.
 

Quote from: newguy on April 03, 2011, 05:39:01 am

Quote from: TonyWoodside on April 03, 2011, 05:26:07 am

Quote from: newguy on April 03, 2011, 05:21:54 am

wow i didnt like connection K yesterday  but today is my friend lol. i found that if signal K matches the superimposed frequency it does wat ive been trying to do manually for two days on its own

All connection "K" does is if the pressure sensor senses too high of a pressure it will send a high signal to the transistor which will cause the the transistor to be active and then the output to the AND gate will be 0v and this will stop the signal from going to the PLL circuit. Its just a safty feature.

   
 
Thats cool i can see if the frequency on connection K is higher then it cuts some pulses off  for instance in the sim it and the imposed signal is running at 120hz  and the output is one for one but if K is raised to 240 hz it cuts the pulses in half and so on. I s that how you see the sensor working or a voltage controlled sensor or something else?

The signal to "K" isn't going to be a pulse signal, its a variable voltage signal from the GMS.

ohhh...  thank ya Mr. Tony
 sorry bout tha silly posts....   keep up the good work man   

wow i didnt like connection K yesterday  but today is my friend lol. i found that if signal K matches the superimposed frequency it does wat ive been trying to do manually for two days on its own I did have to add a FWB to the imposed signal .Ive got the rectified  am signal at 120hz and connection K at 120 hz , the resonate frequency generator(am) set at 5khz.

Quote from: newguy on April 01, 2011, 14:12:15 pm

ok my hopes are back up again....i just picked the first coponents i found to check it again but now the waveform remains the same thru a transformor

Hi Newguy
I have question to You . Is Q4 connected corect in this sim?
andy

nope Andy its not   you'll have to look over me sometimes... im not an electronics guy and nite shift messes with me lol  Do we know the values for the cell driver components  ? ill b try n to fill in the circuit with at least all the  correct variables in the cell driver .... i cant find a transistor configured exactly like the pnp ones on fig 5  does anyone know wat they are or if they are pnp and npn transistors?

Im under the impression this circuit is most important to provide the correct waveform ?
 
well i just changed the d1 to a 1n914 and the frequency to 5khz on the am signal and it looks more like Stans drawings after you let the sim run for a minute and really look at it.Still no adjustment tho and i havent got the cell off or pull ring switches to work.

yet a little closer i believe but still no adjustment.Im not familar with the 74123 chips but there must be a reason he chose it.. i say "it" cawz the 74123 is just a double 74122 but the 74123 is all thats available for the sim.The only thing specific ive found about the chip is that its not a 50% duty cycle like a 555 chip.Im still try'n to fix it the sim tho.Wish we had the frequency generator Stan used cawz in his notes he says its a resonate frequency generator.
 
 
anywho I just changed d1 to 1n418 and its behaven a lil differant, still no dern adjustment tho.

Ive got  cleaner sim now but still no adjustment but im still try'n to fix it.

Mr.Don is it normal to get an output frequency much differant from the input frequency? The sim shows putting in 1khz and outputing 3khz

Howdy just got in from work ...I have a multism 11 started if someone wants to play with it..The 122 option isnt available with the sim so ive been using the 123.I havent figured out how to get the adjustment section tied into the 123 yet.The part i dont understand is connections M1 and B.
 
I stuck the tecktronix scope on it and tried to measure the frequency... weird .....  hope somebody will check it out.Ehh im probably wrong but it looks like the gate is providing the "hit"  lol  I dont know  but will somebody tell me wer the M1 and B connections come from cawz in this sim I made up a pulse for just the M1  connection.

search like this    *74123*

I don't think you understand this whole process.The gasses won't even start to flow until this resonance of the water is hit.The high voltage alone will not produce any gas until it is pulsed to match the resonance of the water in the cell.You won't even have gas flowing until resonance.
Don

Have you ever seen a waveform similar to Steve Meyers with yours or Stans set up? Matching the stretching with  the voltage is neat, kinda like capture the stretch and then pump it apart :)With all the research ive done anything that deals with pumping or resonating requires an oscillating motion.Steve Meyers says that wat most ppl dont get is that wat you see across ur coils to the cell is wat the cell actually sees... something to that effect.Its very interesting to me to look at Steve Meyers waveform and see an entrainning pulse( the rectified half wave) and then see an increasing unipolar oscillating pulse( the resonance pulse) over time.Its kinda like the test point is detecting the resonance and feeding off it somehow.This pumping of the stretch is interesting,sorta like the kid in a swing only instead of pushing the kid over the top we push the strech apart, but wat is it contained within the strech H --- OH  ? Is it an electron or  2 electrons  or something else? More than likely tho wat ever it is within that motion will slow down with an entrainning voltage field to a subharmonic level .If you do find the frequency mathmatically of this motion and apply it and nothing happens .... I remember Stan saying " when you tune in with voltage" Ther surely should be a way to detect the required paremetrs other than volume of gas  
 I wish you could show us a picture of Stan showing his waveform.
im not sure yet how the high frequencies are being added from the scope shots of the 8xa circuit... i dont have one yet to play with but it kinda looks like ther not on at the rite time... i cant wait to get to play with it

Hi Dynodon, Im try'n to learn myself about opamps thru some stuff on this site:
http://www.bcae1.com/opamp.htm
Tony's great at that stuff

for those who understand technical stuff

Quote from: ali on March 16, 2011, 02:18:23 am

Figure 9 Pulser Indicator circuit verified using multisim 11
See attached circuit:
enjoy
(@ don, @ tony...hope it meets with your approval)

Hey Ali, try this one out. only half the feedback coil was being used.

 
I wish i knew electronics cawz ive been searching this week how to get the waveform u made with that adding em together

simple is as simple does

Kali'
Your way off with your turns.
 
Here's the resistance values that I took from the coils with a Fluke meter.
Primary-10.5 ohms
Secondary and chokes-70-75 ohms
Feedback-11.5 ohms
 
Now 29 gauge wire measures 81.83 ohms per 1000 feet,so I come up with the following
 
Primary- 128 feet
Secondary and chokes- 884 feet
 
As for number of turns I come up with
Primary - 600-650 turns
Secondary and chokes - 3000-3500 turns
 
Because they are hand wound and not precision,these should be very close.
 
As for the 220 ohm resister,they were wired across the primary to restrict the current feeding it.10.5 ohms will make the coil heat up with 12 volts feeding it.Some of the coil pacts had three resistors across the primary,all of them were 220 ohm.The largest one was a 5 watt.
Don

 
For mutual inductance, measure the inductance of the primary and secondary in series, and then interchange the connections of one winding for a second reading. Apply the equation below:
M=1/4 (Lserries+  minus Lserries-)

thank you     was it the dublin institute that said the core in theory  wld have a q factory of infinity?   i jus like to think of the cokes as double secondarries lol  It appears to me  the secondary provides the initial voltage field to the plates for alignment purposes of the molecules.... the choke/s appear to  apply an atomic polarization of the atoms ( wich would require an oscillating waveform ... ).. maybe nuclear polarization from there i havent formed further oppinions yet.Im jus glad to be here lol.

ive read wer don said the core is two pieces  butted against each other......  just to ask a question lol  are the chokes on seperate halves  and or wich side is the secondary on compared with the chokes?