Steve

Hi Electrojolt,

Thank you for posting these interesting schematics and weblink.
I checked those schematics  and 1 question raise on the first one.
The place where the first ampmeter is placed is NOT right in my opinion.
Gotulec measures amps before the rectifierbridge.
SOOOOOOOO WRONGGGGGGGGGGGG   
Does he measure amps in RMS?
The volts after a bridge are higher then before it.
So, the power relation is different before and after a bridgerecitifier. P=U.I
Lesson: place ampmeter and voltmeter on the same spot!

Well, its a nice try.

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Steve

Please stay on topic, my dear members.

br
steve

This is Tad. What can I do for you? It looks like there are now quite a few folks that are replicating the Old Meyer system like I did, but with different HV schemes. Looks like it can be done many ways. I just hope these other systems were more reliable than my experiment showed.

This guy is pretty interesting. He seems pretty high strung to be messing with the Meyer stuff but none the less = )

http://www.waterforfuel.com/product4.html

P.S. HV is not 120-500VDC, High voltage that Stan had stated is 600V-10KV. Stan told me he could electrolyze one gallon of water per minute using 10KV of potential. I was only using 1200VDC.

Hi Tad,

Welcome to Ionizationx.com!
I hoped for this to happen after the emails from Fiditti and myself to you.
You are as far as i know the whole Waterfuelcell world the only on that ever duplicated Stans work  proper.
As you can see on the forum, we have some guys here who are good researchers, but what we miss is the final link.
Nobody has done what you reported some years ago.
We would like to replicate your setup and see if we also can achieve the 12watts / 3 ltrs production figures.
I know you told that the circuit is pretty unstable, but we have then a point from where we can start developing it.

What we would like from you is a description of what the variables are and which components you used for that.
I know its a lot to ask.....but would it help if i added a "please"?

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Steve
Administrator Ionizationx

Hi,

I didnt do any testing with magnets, yet.
I think Electrojolt offers a nice suggestion and futher i hope that someone with strong magnets
is willing to do some tests and share the results with us.

The vid shows a massive instandly production. The problem is that he person didnt share any technical details on powerconsumtion.
So, if anybody of you have magnets, please try this small setup and please share info.
It might help us further.

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Steve

Here is a nice video of somebody using a magnet.
You see a turn in the flow of gas which is very interesting!



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Steve

Quote from: stevie1001 on October 05, 2008, 22:37:59 pm

Hi,

I found a good schematic of the auto ignitioncoil.
As you can see, it is actually 1 coil.

An ignition coil is essentially an autotransformer with a high ratio of secondary to primary windings. By "Autotransformer", I mean that the primary and secondary windings are not actually separated - they share a few of the windings.
The ratio of secondary to primary turns in an ignition coil is somewhere around 100:1. The ignition coil is operated directly off a 12 volt source. However, the ignition coil does not work like an ordinary transformer. An ordinary transformer will produce output current at the same time that input current is applied. An ignition coil actually does most of its work acting as an inductor. When the ignition coil is connected to the battery, the inductor is 'charged' with current. It takes a few milliseconds for the current to build up the magnetic field - this on account of reverse voltage caused by the increase in magnetic field. During this short charging period, maybe a thousand volts are produced at the high voltage terminal, not enough to actually cause a spark.

The actual spark is generated when the breaker contacts open.
For an ideal inductor, the current and voltage relate by:

V = L dI
Where V is voltage, L is inductance (in henrys) and dI is the rate of change of the current.


Thus, seeing that L is constant for the inductor, the abrupt change in current will cause a very large voltage to be produced. This produces a very short, very high voltage spike. Of course, the change in current is on the primary side, but because the primary and secondary coils have a large mutual inductance (this is where the transformer part comes in), you get a spike on the order of 100 or more volts on the primary, and 10000 volts on the secondary. Even the primary side of the coil can give you a bit of a jolt if you hold the wires wile disconnecting power. Also note that any contacts you will use will get a lot of sparks, also on account of this.
A less theoretical way of looking at it is that disconnecting the current source will cause the magnetic field in the coil to collapse (because nothing is forcing it magnetic anymore), and the rapid change of magnetic field in turn induces a large voltage in the windings.

In an engine with four or more cylinders, the high voltage terminal of the coil is connected to the distributor, which is just a fancy high voltage rotating switch, for selecting which of the spark plugs needs to be fired. This is much cheaper than having one ignition coil for each cylinder.

Modern cars of course all use electronic ignitions instead of the unreliable mechanical breaker points points for interrupting the current to the ignition coil. However, the ignition coil still works the same way, so you should be able to use an ignition coil even from a modern car. The main thing that has changed is that the 'points' have been replaced with fancy computer gadgetry and power electronics.

One thing that cars usually have that I didn't include in the circuit is a small capacitor across the breaker points, often called the "ignitor". This capacitor in cars before electronic ignition had a tendency to fail over time, so you may have heard people refer to it. The capacitor helps to protect the points by liming voltage across the contacts, so the contacts themselves won't spark. It also forms a bit of a resonant circuit with the coil, and that way enhances the spark, although it probably cuts down on the output voltage a little bit.


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Steve

Wow, you was looking into the auto ignition atleast a week before i stumbled upon it. Thats strange isn't it. 

When you said the back emf from the coil may not contain a high enough voltage to cause an arc, well it does! I'm glad to see that you stumbled upon this so much sooner than i.

Must be something in the air?

That is not so strange it, brother Hydrocars.
We talk more with eachother then with our wifes, last years....:-)
So, our thoughts can go into the same directions.

I thank you for making the idea for exchanging the cap with the wfc.
You explained  that very good. I never thought on shorting the wfc first and then releasing the deadshort to get bemf blast into the wfc.

This is working together and open sourcing in 1.
Together we figure it out!

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Steve

I remember that that turkisch person blew up his whole house with hydrogen
and the goverment thought he was a terrorist...:-)

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Steve

dudly, it is hydrocars. you seen that right.
But as i said earlier, we actually are investigating why it works.
Its all so premature...


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steve

Steve,

Those bubbles appear to be massive.  How big are they?  Are these bubbles comming off your plate cell?  Great job.  I'd like to know a lot more about what you are doing.  I can't place the sound.  Thanks.

Well, there are no plates and no tubes.......
And the noice was a bonus of youtube.....its not in my original video...
Its all in a baby phase. I hope to inform you all soon with more details.

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steve

Hi,

Well, there is always a first for everything.
And here are the first bubles of a working HV water fracturing setup.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zmm2n2OWoHY&feature=user

Br
Steve

ps
sorry for the noice....

Stevie,

You say output can be put into a mosfet or a transistor.  Which would you recommend?  I'm a beginner in electronics.  Thanks.

At these frequency's both are possible.
Mosfets are preferred but are very sensitive and blow up easy.
A 2n3055 transitor is very robust and works too.

I run at this moment a BUZ11 mosfet and it holds with my single cell test setup, but i also have bigger Fets on stock.
You just have to look at the amps and voltages that a specific fet or transistor can handle and take a big marging.
Also use a coolingblock on all your fets and transistors.
And do not forget the diode between the transistor/fet and the +
Coils do give back a puls when you take the power of it. Bemf as we name it. Without the diode, you hit your fet or transistor with that BEMF pulse and you destroy it.

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Steve

um, you guy's probably gonna think im a nut but i just had to come back and post that the outside container of my cell has static all over it, i can stick paper to it,,, its like the static you would find on a TV tube,but its not as strong. the reason i noticed it is because it made the little hairs on my hand tickle when i racked my hand across it,, i then grabed paper to confirm,,, very odd.

Riddler,

Static charge on the outside of the cellwall..
That strange....Nice to read your findings!

Hi,

my 2 cents on this is that you can use 304 for yr wfc.
Its cheaper and it works for me a little bit better.
My best Tube is a 304 one.
The reason can be that the 304 contains more nickel/chromium and those metals are better for electrolysis.
But again, these are just my thoughts on this.


Type Analysis of Stainless Type  304
Carbon 0.08% max. Silicon  1.00% max.
Manganese 2.00% max. Chromium  18.00-20.00%
Phosphorus 0.045% max. Nickel  8.00-10.50%
Sulfur  0.030% max.   
 
Type Analysis of Stainless Type 316:
Carbon 0.08% max. Silicon  1.00% max.
Manganese  2.00% max. Chromium  16.00-18.00%
Phosphorus  0.045% max. Nickel  10.00-14.00%
Sulfur  0.030% max. Molybdenum  2.00-3.00%
 
http://www.bosunsupplies.com/StainlessInfo2.cfm


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Steve

Cn,

can you confirm that the extra bubbles are just vapour?

br
steve

Very nice, CN!

Br
Steve

Very good to hear that you are trying this.
As i do not have compressed air here to do those kind of tests!
Keep us updated CN!

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Steve

Post here your ideas on HV and Hydroxy

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Steve

Now go and see the alternator setup of stan.
He used the neutral of the windings with only 3 diodes for rectifing.
He added chokes to the output of the stator and he created the same collapsing fields and negative spikes.
After these chokes he added again a diode......

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Steve

My cell is styled after Karebills. It's a six cell. Three 316L tubes each, 1" x 10", 3/4" x 9 1/2", And 1/2" x 12". With a 1mm gap between each of the tubes. The over all size of the cell is 2" x 12" x 16".  It will be supplied water by a live well pump, as suggested.

Spike

Looking good, Spike!

Br
Steve

stevie1001,

[WRT stan's VIC] I see a modified FBT (flyback transformer).  Take a look at the square "singular" ferrite configuration - minus the chokes (the left side only is identical to a FBT).  Plus, i've seen the "chokes" in many different formats throughout the S.Meyer literature/docs.  Now take a look at the properties of an unrectified FBT (like an old school one found in a b/w TV).  This is my [VIC] working theory and 2 cents....

I'm new to the forum, and posted this theory in response to your "end of a myth: stanley's VIC" thread.  there's a couple of interesting links there.  as i am still experimenting w/o a cell (electronics only) I cannot test a cell using my FBT(s) - But it's high on my list of things to do...

Hi and welcome to this forum,

There are 2 VIC's in Stanley Meyers mistery world.
1 is the one he uses for electrolysis and 1 for use with his injector.
The one you descripe is for use with this injector system.
The one i wanna clear is for use of electrolysis.

In my case you see a tranformer which creates a higher voltage on the secondy coil.
My theory on that is that the output of that 2 coil is not higher then 200v
Some have ideas that is would be like 600v, but i am quit sertain that it isnt.

Stan used 2 chokes on the same core as the secondairy coil of his transformer.
As you can see on his schematics, he has a floating circuit with no ground in it.
That gives him the possiblility to use positive and negative spikes and pulses.
The polarity on his tubes do NOT change in this case.
With 1 diode, you will have the situation that both pulses are allowed to pass the Tubes.
1 low voltage pulse with some amps and 1 high voltage pulse with low amps.

The collapsing field of the chokes are something special. These will do most of the trick.
Do you know the proces of this coil charging and discharging?
What does and how does a magnetic field collaps?

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Steve