Steve

I have made a simulation of the circuit.
I was expecting to see spikes on top of bias base of lets say 4 volts.
I was surprised to see at the end the famous Stanley Meyer stepup ramp on top on of the 4V bias base...

Here some bad pics....

It seems Stan and Bob are doing the same trick.
The trick is: place a stationary (bias) between the electrodes. Then apply a stepup puls on top of that bias voltage that rips the electrons from the molecules.....

Maybe we need stepup spikes, maybe just this ramp....

I just made a drawing up for myself.
Its based on the idea's of Bob.

The idea is using a steady bias DC on the WFC. With 1 tube and with use of KOH, just must think about 2V.
The pulsing is done on a toroid with very short high peak pulses. Short enough that almost no BEMF is produced..
The sharp pulses are picked up on top of the DC tru the toroid.
That must cause some kind of reaction.
All chokes are there to preved emf leakage.

Because of the bridge rectifier, there is no separated diode needed.
What do you guys think of this? I havent test it, but its a pretty nice circuit.


Steve

His 101 cell did not work, and the is a faulty or was with his pulse circuit board,
A group that I was with followed his direction to the letter and had a board from him set to the group, cost the group around $3,000, then they asked me to come and put my instalments and scope to work, that is when I found the flaw  when asked about it he could not give a straight answer. So we challenged him to show us with his own 101 cell and put it on Utube.
Next I was banned from a lot of forums.
Ravis cell was the best and there is some other secrets that I can tell the group about this type of cell.

Well, he did condition the tubes and had a very small gap.
Anything else, Aussepom?.

I saw that too!
 
Be carefull not to blow it out of proportion.
 
Warp is an administrator I guess that gives him the ability to modify any post?

Yes, Warp is also an admin. As founder of this forum, he and me (owner) are admins.
I removed 2 posts with no other content then fighting.

Steve

Steve, 

Do you have any values for the  choke, capacitors, and resistor ?

What is the frequency at the transformer input ?   60 Hz ?

Hi Goeytex,

Try to make the circuit in this simulator:

http://www.ionizationx.com/circuit/index.html

I did. That way you can find out what best components and frequencys are.

Steve

I have an idea on Master Steve's setup:
 
A 1:1 transformer, aka chokes, aka vic.
 
2 capacitors, one on each side of the transformer.
 
Isolated power supply for each half of the transformer and capacitor.
 
Use a stepup transformer to drive each half of the circuit.
 
Once in resonance, on each half, and 180 deg. out of phase from one another the current draw becomes low.
 
Add a diode for positive on one and negative from the other and connect to the water fuel cell.
 
The current will be low because of the isolated power supplies driving the circuit.
 
The water fuel cell will see the distributed capactance of the 1:1 transformer and allow that current to flow - which is very small in the overall schematic, yet be stressed by the high voltage potential of the steup up transformer.
 
Anyone with electronic experience can follow that and fill in the blanks, even point out some flaws I may have overlooked in this setup.
 
 
Anyhow that is my next project - still gathering equipment for this.

Sounds good Warj.

Attached schematic is also providing a 180 out of phase volts vs amps..

http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Pines/5440/supply.html

Steve

Steve, when you remember.... I have a check for you for $50,000US for further development.

I am just starting to remember........

thats a bb aetup. Same as i did

Hi, I had some conversations with Bob.
I like to share them with you:

This part is about inductors.
All 3 inductors are of the toroidal variety in the trucker system. I know there will be those that may not like to hear it, but the best results were observed with silver plated, stranded, teflon insulated wire. This can be purchased from surplus outlets. The stranded version of this wire does not work on the large 3 phase toroid itself, yet works great on the chokes used to prevent that energy from leaking out of those 3 phase toroidal systems. Heavy guage stranded and solid copper house wire, and solid magnet wire were tried, and did not have the same results. This is not to say that they may not be made to work, just that they did not work in the configurations tested.

In the trucker system, the common + connected toroid is wound full fill with AWG 4, and both of the - connected toroids are wound full fill with AWG 8. I tried different sizes of toroids, and compared the results. There was not much noticed increase from using larger toroids, other than it lowered the required frequency to be applied. The Q is low, so the peak is broad, and tuning is not super-critical. All pulsing used in the commercial application was below 250 Hz in this particular application.

Exact toroid specs are pretty much useless here, as the characteristics of the cell(s) this is connected to will dictate what works best. However it may be useful to note that the toroid cores used were MicroMetals 45 mix, the same as that used for the more recent chokes recommended for the large 3 phase toroidal systems. The smallest toroid cores tested were T157-45, and the largest were T400-45. I did try one of the large T650-52 as used in the 3 phase toroidal power system, but the result was just not worth the much higher cost and the space required.

Hope this helps
Bob Boyce


Second part is on how that toroid of him should work:

Bobs system part2:


Pulsing dc into toroid on 3 primary's
Chokes must prevent electron leakage when powerpuls is off.
secondairy coil is hooked between dc and wfc. Voltage on the secondairy is must not exceed level that starts electrolysis. A Bias like voltage. Never let voltage drop towards 0 volts.
The 3 primairy's must provide a signal waveform that provides enough power to start electrolysis in some way..?? BOB?
3 frequencys are capable of creating a stepup ramp. When freq 1 is pulsing you have a low step. When 2 frequency's hit the same time, the pulse on the secondairy will be twice as high then a single puls.
And when all 3 pulses hit the toroid at the same time, the pulse on the secondairy will be 3 times as high then a single puls.
The pulse it self is square. Play with Mark and space and with voltage levels to get optimum result.


If i miss something, please join in, Bob!

His answer:
Sorry, I have been extremely busy providing customer support for those customers and dealers that have been left "out in the cold" so to speak by the manufacturer. I solved the problems by reflashing the controllers back to the original firmware that I had proven was working properly prior to me leaving. This removed all of the manufacturers malware that they had been updated with, and I corrected the calibration values back to original specs. The original units out there are now working as designed again.

The simplified pulsing system does not use the same multi-phase drive as the larger toroidal system. Though the description you gave does describe that larger toroidal system very well. The steps in pulsing levels are very effective in that system.

The simplified system also uses a choke on the power bus side to prevent EMI leakage through to the vehicles power system. How it differs is that each cell unit has a single choke in series with it that uses the pulses provided by the control devices (FETs or DC SSRs). The programming is such that pulses of the same repetition rate are provided at all times that the system is on. Pulse width is adjusted between 0% (full off) and 99% (full on) in 1% steps to control current. On any feedback type control system, the shunt must also be isolated from any EMI produced in order to function properly.

Bob Boyce

Hi Aussepom,

I seen your video message to Bob. I totally agree with you on this. Me too didnt have any sign of something mysterious, or big trick.
Its all bogus of the first degree.

Maybe, if Bob has balls, he tell you what to do, but he probably will not. He just wants BIG money.

Steve

I like your view on things, Aussepom!

br
steve

Hi Cowboy,

I think Bob wants to see some money from poor suckers who gonna buy his controller.
Till this moment, NOBODY ever showed me a working device, doing what Bob claims.
And now, he is even gonna tell us that we cannot use the word CONTROLLER?
Hahahahahaha. Sorry. Just like somebody is telling me not to use the word WATER...

br
Steve

Hi Steve
                  guess what I have been banned from workingwatercar, must have been the last post I sent in, maybe they do not like is being found out, I expect that Hydroxcy, and the the others will follow, well I don't care it is what we have found out and that's bad luck if they do not like it. photobucket will carry more pic, the reason it was there is that one was a few
megbytes long. I have more to go on there and there will be a continuation here if thats ok with you Steve.
aussepom

Its a shame they banned you, Aussepom!
I also have my doubts on the Bob setup. I know that Wouter and Watkij are trying their best on this and they have contact with Bob.
I also produced all kind of waveforms with my circuits here.....
The only thing from Bob that made sense was the idea of destablizing the water with multiple frequency's....
Looks like the more dirtier the signal from your circuit with coils, the better.....

Well, if  others want to come over here, to develope further the Bob system, its fine by me.
I watched yr video's. You made a nice setup there.
BUT please watch out with that big cell. There is a lot of space on top of it where hydroxy is stored.......
Before you know it, you blow yr house up..


br
Steve

Ps.
Please use dots in your texts...Its much better to read it with those dots...

Hi Aussepom,

Have you read this topic, yet?
Its about the Bob replication of me and Electrojolt.

http://www.ionizationx.com/index.php/topic,695.0.html


br
Steve

Aloha,

Sorry, I thought that it was clear that this is what Stan was doing. I believe that the reason we are having so much trouble making progress is because, although we know what was done and what components were used, we don't  understand where we are going.

If you can add current to break waters bonds, and if the three primary elements in water are hydrogen, oxygen, and electricity, why are not we considering the most obvious option? You believe that you can take oxygen from water? You believe that  that you can take hydrogen from water? Why don't you know and understand that you can take electricity from water?

Do you understand the basic natural laws of electrical saturation? That law is that everything in our atmosphere, according to it's nature (wood, iron, rock, water) has electrical saturation. Anything with a surplus of saturation, say an iron pole in wind, will release that surplus at the first opportunity. Anything with a deficiency of saturation will decompose if it is not allowed to draw in more electricity from the plentiful supply all around us in the enviroment.

Of all substances that we know of, water seems to be the most willing to co-operate with it's decomposition and transmutation. At the slightest hint, water will become steam, mist, vapor, liquid, solid. It will become a fuel as hydrogen/oxygen and in spite of us just turn back into water.

Big coils and inductors do more than generate voltage spikes. They can also act as a current vacuum as part of their process. Have you not read that in pulsed electrolisis, it is during the off cycle that the hydrogen is generated? How do you understand this? How do you explain this?
Bill
P.S. My brother has written for Lucas on Star Wars projects. True.

Hi Bill,


I like to read al this theory. But in practisch, what can we do with it.
If you use 2 plates and push water thru it into a hose and then into 2 other plates, you have your setup. On the first 2 plates you put power, and you put a lightbulp/transformer on the second 2 plates.
The theory is that you get ride of electrons in the water. No electrons, no covalent bondings....
I have light a bulp that way. So that works. I didnt measure correctly the amps and volts on both set of plates. I will in the near future..

No offense, but i have seen so many theory,s but nody proved it. Maybe a coil is a current vacuum. I believe what i and Brian have seen and have tested. A coil , when pulsed creates a magnetic field and when the pulse goes off, the magnetic field collapses and current flows from that. That change happens with help of something like photons. Its to complex to explain, but  you can see it happening on a scope. The high voltage spike happens in the off time of the pulse and when the coil is correctly wired, the spike goed into the wfc.
It is possible that that spike is hitting hard on the watermolecule.
For sofar...


br
steve

I am here, young Skywalker...:-)

Bill,

Its an interesting theory. Have you and your researchers already made any kind of testsetup to verify/confirm this? I can confirm to you that the wfc acts like: battery, capacitor, resistor and isolator. I also know that we can use any kind of circuit to power the wfc. Each of them will give you gas. One with less power and the other one with more power.
The proces of electron extracting works. I confirmed it. You can extract current from a charged wfc. But only when you charged it first.
If you wanna test with that, i can give you some tips, if you like.
 
br
Obiwan Kenobi

Hi guys,

The best thing is still doing. Run tests. Find out if sertain things work or not.
I agree that there is a lot of crap out there. And some are delivered on purpose to mislead the people.
I have seem many examples. Its very easy to do.

As long as people like Dingel and others dont share there info, its up to you and me.


Br
Steve

this is a shot from kampen72 series cell , the flashback part

the series cell itself is a break through , its been around for 40 odd years or so but it seems that in the Hydrogen community it is just another cell construction

Les plate dimension 180mm x 100mm = 18000mm^2   ,multiply that  x 138 = 4,968,000mm^2   surface area of both sides of the plates ....and NONE of them are hooked up to power , they are ALL neutral plates!!!!
this doesnt include the area of the positive and negative plates

Ive got george wisemans "browns gas" book at the moment and his research is very important , it eliminates the transformer so straight away there are zero transformer losses
George Wisemans name deserves to be up there with Yul Brown or when ever monatomic hydrogen is mentioned

The cell of Kampen72 is just a normal serie drycell , like we all made, in the past.
Bob Boyce, or Goerge Wiseman or yul brown or me.....
All made the same cell with just 2 electrodes hooked up the the power.
The power must be unregulated. Pulsed, so to speak.
That way you create browns gas, with 1 till 3 % monotomic hydrogen, with a higher energy then H2.
All proven techno.....
I am looking forward to see if Kampen gets a self runner, but i predict that he will not.
He can only make it work, if he uses a bubbler filled with rubbing alcohol.....
That way he will get some carbon attached to his hydrogen and slows down burnrate and get more gas mass.

cheers

Here is an article I found in a recent issue of Nexus magazine:
A WATER FUELLED CAR
by carl Cella

I am the madman behind the US heavy-metal band, "Rampage", but long before my musical success I was mechanically inclined, and the possibility of running a car on fuel extracted from water intrigued me no end.
After reading all the information >I could find on the subject of hydrogen generators, I built my first actual unit in 1983, mounting it in the trunk of a 1979 Cadillac Coupe de Ville.
I constructed my system from the best of all the other systems I read about, and then went even further, using the strongest materials and cleanest layout possible within reason. All the titanium nuts and bolts were scored from an aircraft salvage supply: they're cheaper, used, and since they'll never wear out that's one way to save some big bucks. Certain head and exhaust system modifications have to be made to expect trouble-free extended use. For one, the combustion of hydrogen results in the rebonding of the previously-separated hydrogen and oxygen molecules, making the engine's exhaust water vapour steam, and nothing else - meaning absolutely no pollution at all!
Most auto makers use cast-iron exhaust manifolds and steel valves. The combined effects of heat and moisture (moisture not being present in the combustion of petroleum-based fuels) cause extremely rapid corrosion of the system. Part of the fix is to install stainless-steel valves and an exhaust system constructed entirely out of stainless steel. Racing shops sell stainless-steel valves and stainless-steel 'turbo' mufflers that all work fine. Since hydrogen does not contain lead as some gasoline does, if you're not using a late-model, no-lead engine, the heads will have to be reworked to include valve seats not needing the lubrification lead provides.
As for building this device to sell as a completed system, that's a dead issue. In 1983, I contacted the Department of Energy to show them that my car actually worked. I was confronted by two very belligerent 'agents of tyrannical oppression' who told me that if I tried to sell pre-built units, I'd have a lot of "problems". I asked zhy, demanding an explanation, asd was told very bluntly, and not in a very nice tone: "Do you have any idea what a device like this, available to the public, would do to the economy?"
This technology is so simple that anyone with over half a brain - and knowledgeable in auto mechanics - can build one of these units. I've included comprehensive, no-bullshit, drafted design layouts, parts lists, maintenance tips, and a whole lot of engine modification concepts to make construction, part fabrication and implementation as easy as reasonably possible.
The unit I built works as great as I claim it to, but I offer only the printed information on how to build your own, and I take no personal responsibility for damage of any kind caused to your vehicle or self.
I have only applied my unit to a carburetted engine; I've never attempted an application to a fuel-injected engine, nor do I make any such claim that an application of that type would be easily performed, if possible at all.
Every cubic foot of water contains about 1,376 cubic feet of hydrogen gas and 680 cubic feet of oxygen. Because there is no pollution produced, all smog devices may be completely removed, legally, and your car exempted from smog checks, as are propane-powered vehicles.
The only maintenance I have encountered is, periodically, to wire-brush mineral deposits off the reaction chamber electrodes and, at longer intervals, to clean out the chamber itself - neither of which is complicated or very time consuming. I've incorporated so many backup electrodes so this job won't be required roadside - as it was for me when I first used only one, not knowing about any deposits entirely covering the electrodes and thus halting the electrical reaction process. When the car dies out, you just flip another switch until you're somewhere able to brush the reactor's electrodes clean in reasonable comfort - and not northbound on Highway 5, halfway between Los Angeles and San Francisco, where my first breakdown was.
Where the steel gasoline tank used to be, a plastic water tank is fitted, along with an electric float sensor that should be attached to the vehicle's existing fuel gauge. If you were to start your engine with no midifications other than the carburettor to accept hydrogen fuel, it will run fine but the exhaust system will corrode in almost no time, and if you leave the engine turned off for an extended period, your stock valves and guides will rust up and seize!
Stainless-steel valves don't cost much and are as trouble-free as the stainless-steel exhaust system, so don't be a fool and try to go cheap because you'll only cause yourself added expense and headaches, and you'll be cursing me for your own stupidity. For the cast-iron combustion chambers and valve ports, there is a high-temperature ceramic coating called "heanium" that can be pre-formed to guard against the same corrosion that affects the valves, guides, exhaust system and also the intake manifold, as moisture down there will also cause corrosion.
Petroleum-based fuels have their own detergent action that protects against corrosion, much like soaking parts in oil prevents corrosion. When using hydrogen as an internal combustion engine fuel, extra precautions must be taken to make extended operation a reality, and not some drive-a-few-thousand-miles-between-fried-engines bullshit.
Don't use sea water! It contains approximately three-fourths of a pound of salt in every gallon. Salt is a material that will coat the electrodes very quickly, just making one big mess. The reason for electrode deposit buildup is that tap water is never 100 per cent pure: it contains mineral contaminants that are drawn to the traction-chamber electrode during the electrically-activated molecular separation process, that results in the hydrogen contained in water being released from the oxygen molecules they are bonded to, making a fuel that can power an internal combustion engine.
I offer no design for an exhaust steam condenser, but I do make the suggestion that one applicable to an automobile can be built to increase the cost-free mileage even further between fill-ups. A concept would include some form of exhaust-fed radiator that could incorporate air ducts, leading from scoops, to direct highway speed airflow across it.
I offer the idea, but not the design, because many aspects must be considered, such as: the least amount of back pressure, unit pressure, unit placement with regard to configuration by the limit or abundance of that space - though this one would be constructed for a stationary, engine-powered electrical generator, where space limitation is of no concern.
Remember, the cylinder walls are cast iron and prone to rust, but they can be kept clean by piston action (as long as it's not left sitting for long periods between use).
An automobile engine could feasibly be constructed with non-corrosive stainless-steel heads and cylinders straight from the factory - a solid reason to justify spending twenty-five grand or more for a car, because the fuel to run it would be free.
There has been much criticism over hydrogen as an auto fuel, most of it coming straight from those who have the most to lose if hydrogen ever achieves widespread use as an automotive fuel.
There are some factory-built high-performance cars on the market that already come with stainless-steel valves, but they are few and far between, and you still have to change the exhaust systems.
For the carburettor to accept vapour-state fuel, it must be converted using the same parts that are used in propane/butane engine fuel systems, such as carburettor kits by "IMPCO", or similar, that do the same thing, i.e. enable your engine to be powered by a vapour-state fuel.
Because no pollution is produced, the engine may be rebuilt 'legally' with higher performance parts, like a camshaft that, in gasoline, would have increased exhaust pollutant emissions, thus making it 'illegal' for highway use. Of course, it's only a 'crime' if you get 'caught', but those pay-again-every-time-your-vehicle-fails smog checks are a pain in the * , not to mention the wallet.
A similar type of mechanism that opens and closes tretractable headlights could be implemented in a dashboard switch-activated system that could open a trunk lid-mounted scoop that captures rain, with a flexible hose line that directs it into the main tank, either while the vehicle is in motion or parked. Just watch the fuel gauge, and close the scoop when you see "Full"!
While it may be a long time before we are able to purchase an entirely corrosion-resistant, exotic alloy engine, I am offering the complete design for a hydrogen generator that will power a car - but any engine modifications I outline are only given as basic concepts. It's up to you to implement what is applicable to your particular engine. Use some initiative. Don't rely on whether I wrote it or not. If you discover a part or process that I haven't mentioned, that will in any way protect your engine further from the effects of corrosion, use it! I've written this to help people wake up from the big lie of having to depend on oil companies just to drive a car.
Building as many units as I can for personal use only, and writing this booklet, are about the only things I can 'legally' do to try to help the world wake up. A hydrogen generator produces an energy potential in excess of 100 per cent efficiency!!! You read it right: free energy!
A car's battery starts the engine, but once it's running, the alternator takes over to charge the battery and power the ignition system. With an onboard hydrogen generator, that alternator also powers the hydrogen extraction process, producing the energy needed to fuel the engine that runs the alternator. No external power source is needed; so long as there is water available, the entire system is self-sufficient in operation. An estra trunk-mounted battery would provide more current - if ever needed - to run everything at once without overloading the electrical system.
System Operation The dash-mounted switches for turning on the reactor are also wired to activate the chamber feedwater pump at the same time. When the car dies out, that signals to you that an electrode has been totally crusted over with deposits from the impure fuel water. This means the electrically-activated molecular separation process (electrolysis) has halted. These switches should also have indicator lights to let you know which one is on, and flip-up caps to guard against accidental activation.
When the need arises to go to back-up, turn off the switch for the 'dead' electrode, as well as close its electrical shut-off-valve. The purpose of these gas valves is to keep pressurised oxygen from escaping up through the 'off' electrode fittings into the hydrogen lines, possibly resulting in your car becoming a "Highway Hindenburg"!
Hydrogen is separated from its molecular bond with oxygen by exposing the fluid of water to direct-current voltage. Hydrogen is attracted to a negative charge, while oxygen is attracted to a positive charge. This process generates heat in the chamber, so trunk placement is best with an aluminium or plywood wall built between the reactor and the rest of the available trunk space. Small cars are light on gasoline, thus cheaper to operatr, but when all of a sudden the fuel becomes free, the size and weight of the car is of no concern, except for Porsches and similar sportscars, street rods etc.
Water is pumped through the reaction chamber, which itself is positively charged, drawing the oxygen molecules out through the water return line to be vented off through the water tank's cap. The hydrogen-attracting electrode extending into the welded-in pipes (and insulated under the t-fitting) is negatively charged. There is a dash-mounted pressure-gauge that is connected before the regulator and mixer. To gbegin hydrogen generation, flip one of the dash-mounted switches and wait for the gauge to show fuel-line pressure; then start the engine when pressure is shown by the gauge to exist. In mounting the unit, remember that the chamber itself is positive, and most cars use a negative chassis ground, so insulated mounts must be fabricated between the positive chamber and the negative trunk-floor.
As a final note, this unit is not a concept or a theory! It is tried and proven! I designed this system at age 18 in 1983, and built more than one, using Rampage profits for research and development.
I can't sell actual working units, but nothing but death itself can stop me from distributing this information in the hope that people will take the initiative to wake up from the big lie of oil-dependency for auto fuel, and flood the street with hydrogen-powered cars.
If enough people find out how simple it is, public pressure may someday soon be put on the government, resulting in the long overdue media exposure they're all so afraid of. Eyewitness News (Channel 7) in Los Angeles didn't want to let the word out that an actual working vehicle had been built by an 18-year-old metalhead! We're supposed to be stupid in the public's eye, from their point of view!
Hydrogen and oxygen gases do not pollute; they help clean out carbon deposits from the engine for better mileage and less engine wear. You'll notice the improved engine performance immediately.
(Source: Carl Cella, PO Box 8101 (4176-X), San Luis Obispo, CA 93409-0001, USA.
Originally published in
Iron Feather Journal No. 13, PO Box 1905, Boulder, CO 80306, USA, and in
Psychedelic Illuminations VIII, Fall/Winter 1995/96, PO Box 3186, Fullerton, CA 92634, USA)
NOTE: see also two separate pages of line drawings (construction plans)
CONSTRUCTION PLANS (1)
CONSTRUCTION PLANS (2)
In any case, anyone who's really interested should be able to get one of the two publications cited above, or buy the current issue of NEXUS magazine. If you can't find it on a newsstand, here is their address:
PO Box 177, Kempton, IL 60946-0177 USA tel. 815 253 6464 and fax 815 253 6300
(I don't have a deal with that magazine or anyone else for that matter, only want to see the technology applied. For some background information on other systems of hydrogen-fuelled engines, you can find something on my home page - see the technology section).

Hi,

Found this doc on woodgas.
Very interesting stuff!

br
steve