HMS-776

The picture I posted last is of the driving circuit, the most important circuit to understand in order to figure out the steam resonator.
Kali_ma_Amar explained this circuit well on page 4 of this topic but there are still a few things I would like to point out, and figure out...

First, the circuit has a bridge rectifier just like the steam resonantor used in the dune buggy. It appears that the rectified output was put through a 12V regulator and a transistor which I think was used to pulse the primary coil in the home heating unit.

Each steam resonator (the home heating unit and the dune buggy) has 2 NPN and 2 PNP transistors.

The steam resonator is not a capacitor, and inductor, or a resistor. I think current is limited by the coil reactance and the high watt resistors only.

(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu141/Hms-776/steamres3.png)

I would like to point out once again using the circuit above that the steam resonator tubes are nothing more than conductive surfaces placed in the water. A current and voltage wave will travel through them, the polarity of the wave depending on the direction of current flow through the conductor. Although there is no voltage build up and a very small voltage drop across the tubes there is still a voltage wave which passes through the tubes. Pulsing this wave back and forth at high speed and switching the direction of the traveling wave is what ultimately causes the water to heat up. I learned when studying transmission lines that voltage waves propogate at the speed of light(1).

(1) Ref http://www.allaboutcircuits.com/vol_2/chpt_14/3.html


Now as far as questions I have is about the coil itself....The dune buggy steam resonator coil has 3 coils (6 wire ends) while the home heating unit looked to have 7 wires coming out of it...Maybe 3 coils, 1 center tap?

So, what I'm wanting to know now is how the coil was designed. I tend to think each had 1 primary coil and 2 secondary coils bifilar wound, but that is a theory I have yet to prove out....

Back to the steam resonator:

I was studying the driving circuit for the home heating unit and I realized it also has a bridge rectifier like the one used for the dune buggy.
(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu141/Hms-776/123232.png)

Above you'll see the bridge rectifier circled in red, made of individual diodes.
I'm still not sure what purpose it serves through...The input to the rectifier is 24VAC...

Newguy

"the gated signal that allows the hydrogen to pair up with opposite spin into diatomic hydrogen, allowing release of gasses"

Here is the Tech Brief reference to the statement you said Steve Meyer made:

Tech Brief page 1-7

"The liberated and moving atoms (having missing electrons) regain or capture the free floating electrons once applied voltage is switched off during pulsing operations. The liberated and electrically stabilized atom having a net electrical charge of "zero" exit the water bath for hdrogen gas utilization."

It would be cool if we could take a high speed camera and synchronize it with the cell's pulsing to see if gas is only released during the gating off time!

I guess I need to go do more studying. Thanks for the explanation!

That's a great explanation,

Do you think dielectric breakdown is what is splitting the water though?
Perhaps I'm wrong but I was under the impression that dielectric breakdown results in arcing?
Also, the voltage in the cell will rise toward infinity but it is still limited by the components in the circuit, the coils will see that voltage and if the voltage gets to high the coils will breakdown.

I think the dielectric breakdown of water requires a voltage in the MV range. Perhaps there is something I am not understanding though....

(Ref: )

That is awesome,

One thing I have wanted to mention for a while:

In the WFC ions are created. The ions which are created collect near the oppositely charged plates, producing a voltage within the cell which will rise to a higher voltage than the circuit can produce. Under the right conditions this voltage will go into a runaway effect, rising to infinity (The ions will increase the voltage which will in turn produce more ions). This is one of the reasons for gating the circuit, to limit the max voltage inside the cell.
Ref: Delearship sales manual pF7

This further explains the transistor theory. The HV is creating ions.  I know Tony you mentioned before that you were getting much higher voltages near your cell than throughout the rest of the 8XA circuit, this is why.

In order for the ions to become stable atoms they must recieve or give an electron. The Cell forms an NPN transistor with the SS being the N type material. If you look at the atoms which are mixed with the iron to make SS you can see those atoms give the ss material it's symmetry with N type semiconductor material.

http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/solids/dope.html

Agreed,

A few years back I spent some time on energeticforum.
At the time I thought it was as Stan had explained (physical forces pulling the molecule apart).
I continued to have a rather lengthy argument with a more knowledgeable person who kept on insiting that there has to be a charge exchange medium of some sort. Now I understand what she meant, although neither of us knew about the transistor model at the time.

We know scientifically that high voltage increases the auto-ionization (amount of ions) of the water!

One thing I still wonder is if the explanation Stan gave was possible....If the molecule could be pulled apart without producing ions???
Perhaps both situations are occuring in the cell, but it seems more likely that all the HV is doing in increasing the autoionization.

wfchobby, I also posted on this a while back.

The transistor model is deifinately the most likely model of the WFC. It was first introduced by Stephen Meyer on a radio interview.
Please read: http://www.ionizationx.com/index.php/topic,2291.msg21951.html#msg21951

(BTW, thanks TonyW for posting the radio interviews on your site)

Donaldwfc, I think your right. In one of Meyer's news releases he states that the steam resonator is a spinoff of the VIC technology.

The steam resonator prevented the water from freezing. Not sure if the pictures I posted were the one used in th buggy?

Go to youtube and watch this video of someone who has replicated it.

Donaldwfc, thanks for contributing.

I think your right on about the steam resonator VIC.

As far as building...Not sure yet but hopefully I'll start building this summer....

I gave up a few years back after I spent over 1,000$ on useless crap....I realized at that time that I was not educated enough to replicate Meyer, now I'm feeling ready!


BTW, still have no idea why there is a bridge rectifier in the circuit?

Yeah, the bridge rectifier is confusing me the most with that circuit....I'm wondering if it's not a bridge rectifier, but it definately looks like one.

TonyW pointed out before that the circuit is similiar to a H-Bridge circuit used to control the direction of an electric motor.

I think there are many different ways of making the steam resonator work....I'm just wanting to know how this one worked.....

In Blogtalkradio interview # 4 with Stephen Meyer (Stan's twin brother and electrical engineer) Stephen talked about the Water Fuel Cell and it's symmetry with a transistor.

Semiconductors are made by adding impurities to a material to make either an N type or P type material.

http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/solids/dope.html#c2


Stephen also states the use of the Stainless Steel material is important. Noting that the material is mostly iron, impurities are added to make the stainless steel. The impurities being Nickel and Chromium.


The water fuel cell is very much like a schottky barrier which is a potential barrier formed at a metal-semiconductor junction.
(In a metal semiconductor junction the metal is a N type material.)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schottky_barrier

As we know water is conductive, the conductivity of water largely depends on the impurities.
(Water is really a semiconductor)

When we combine water and Stainless steel we have just created a Schottky junction/barrier. If a potential is applied and the junction is correctly biased electrons will flow out of the Stainless steel's Fermi layer and into the water.

http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/solids/band.html#c5




What is also interesting in the reason why electrolyte is added to the water in electrolysis.
Basically in electrolysis a depletion layer forms at each electrode which blocks current flow and halts the electrolysis process.

In order for the process to continue current must flow.
This can be done by adding an electrolyte, or by increasing the voltage across the cell.

“Unless a very large potential is applied to cause an increase in the autoionization of water the electrolysis of pure water proceeds very slowly limited by the overall conductivity.” -Wikipedia Electrolysis of water-electrolyte selection



It seems like Stephen is hinting that the barrier which is formed allows access to a huge amount of electrons from the fermi layer. But for this to occur the junction must be biased. And if biased correctly more electrons will be released from the stainless steel's Fermi layer than will travel through the circuit. Also, the high voltage will increase the autoionization of the water which allows the efficiency to increase!


Now the question to ask is.....Would it be possible that more electrons will be released from the Fermi layer than the electrons which actually flow through the circuit?   

There is one paper I found which has a lot of similarities to what I described above....

"  A simple model to determine the trends of electric field enhanced water disassociation in a bipolar membrane  "

   Link:

Anyone know any good sources for 29 AWG magneti wire, or M27 electrical Steel sheet?

Don

I'm seeing the same thing with my multisim replication. I get AC no matter which side of the diode I measure.
If I use an oscope to measure the Vdrop across the diode I see unipolar pulses. (no frequency doubling)
I should point out that my multisim replication has a somewhat high line current (over 20mA) and I'm getting the same results
so I don't think this is due to the small current that you mentioned.

Tony reminded me that stan states M27 in one of his documents, I'll have to find out which document though to find out if it's for the  dual U core vic or another one.

Dos anyone know what the permeabiity is supposed to be?

Yeah I bought some from you don, took your advice as well and
used a guillotine paper cutter to cut out the e and I sections, it
worked well.  Thanks for all your contributions.

Very interesting.

I was reading in the dealership sales manual earlier about the ions and electrons in the cell increasing the cell voltage beyond the applied voltage.

In the area of electron deflection, the electrically charged atoms moving towards the water molecules further disrupt the covalent bonding, while at the same time increasing the electrical charges inside the fuel cell during the electrical polarization process. Increasing the number of electrically charged atoms within the fuel cell directly increases the voltage charges within the same cell while the applied voltage pulse frequency potential remains the same...increasing gas yield while power input remains the same.

-Delearship Sales manual Page F7

I tend to wonder if the voltage at each plate is really the same though, since each choke outputs AC there would have to be some kind of coupling between the plates, perhaps polarization causes that so I don't want to discount it.

I tend to think that the polarity of the plates is always opposite but changes with each pulse. The reason why I think this is occuring is because I think it would increase the resonant action (also called compounding).

Simply moving liberated atoms back and forth uniformly through the electrical polarization process in a repetitive manner establishes resonant action in the fuel cell.

-Delearship Sales Manual page F6

I think the above statement is explaining that AC is used to move the atoms back and forth, but as we know Meyer never really stated anything plainly, it's open to interpretation.

Ok, 50kHz was what I was thinking also but I could not remember for sure...

Yeah that's most likely CRGO (Cold Rolled Grain Oriented) M4 electrical steel. It's the same stuff I used, it's 3mm also. I actually got mine from Don a while back.

So back to what you mentioned about the water's dielectric constant and tuning into it. I'm working to find out about what effect dielectric polarization has on leakage current. Is that what you were getting at about tuning into the water's dielectric?

Also, what turns ratio did you have in your small injector VIC?

Thanks everyone for the input, and sorry for all the questions tony....I'm just trying to get as many opinions and as much info as I can. I think the more we input we get on these forums the more we'll be able to rule out and understand.