haithar

how is this done in detail?
if you are creating electricity of a moving part (rotor for example) you are stealing energy from it.

i know the dimensions are small, but that is just for verifying the theory. there cannot be current with this apparatus!

Quote from: WaytoGo on July 28, 2009, 08:14:54 am

Quote from: Dankie on July 28, 2009, 05:27:39 am

An alternator produces a sine wave .

A sine wave is much smoother than pulsed dc , on the scope I can see that this rhytmic motion will do better than pulsed dc . It just makes sense that it would .

I have a 300W pure sine wave inverter and with the right plate spacing the gas output is extreme.
Have read that inverters can today have a efficiency up to 95% comparing the input and output.. but the energy in the HHO gas produced is at the moment unknown for me... Didn't Master Steve use a inverter for that motorbike idling?...Hmmm   

Master Steve used 2 VIC's with blocking diodes and resonating chokes in where he got LC resonance and he busted water with 40Kv and 1mA, producing a massive 100ltres per second.

But i just forgot how to replicate it..


Steve

that's a sad thing. 
as always, it seems many people do have some good results but no other can replicate it because there are no good documents. and if there are good documents (like ravi) it does not work.

i'm intrigued by warps post but i never read something about 3500rpm, an alternator or that FQA30N40. It's probably because i did not read every post of every account he is using word for word, but if you could make like a document where you collect your knowledge, in a way that the others from this forum can understand and then replicate (i'm sure there would be enough people to try it), we could all get this working together. communication is really the problem, everyone is doing his own stuff, there is so much false information, and everyone would have to figure it out for himself, not to say most of the people at the waterfuelcell.org forum for example don't have any clue about electronics and mess things up more.

when the first step (getting more HHO energy than you put in via electricity) it's not important if you cannot run YOUR car on this immediately. there are plenty of options afterwards. (even stan ran only a lightweight dunebuggy with it)

so which of those two images is right now?

i measured the properties of my tubes and got my capacitance calculated. for all 4 tubes it should be 0,63nF, with my l/c-meter i measured 1,00nF, so this could be right more or less. unfortunately i do not know how to calculate the parasitic capacity of my coil which would make the whole capacity larger.

another problem i do have with my coil: i measured 1,23µH for each one with my l/c-meter. but i calculated a capacitance of now 25µH for both in series. however i do not know the relative permitivitty of my ironpowder core, a table here says it's between 300 and 3000. taking the minimum of 300 leaves me with 7,6mH. Ohmic resistance of the coil and the wires to the cap is 2,6Ohms.
As a dielectric constant for water i take 77, the lowest value too. All my caps together should have ~50nF while filled with water.

L,C,R bring me to a resonant frequency of 3,2kHz, but again i do not know. The µr factor alone could change the frequency tremendously.

Great job Haithar , I see this was done without a diode , plz see the effect with a diode , investigate further , dont give up on SM .

this was only a picture taken from wikipedia, not what i really have. i don't own a digital oscilloscope or a digital system to record everything, only an analog one.
the waveform should be more or less the same of course, they used a diode to filter the back emf.

The voltage as seen by the choke would resemble the red current exponential curve.
How is the current from the collapsing field inhibited? By the second choke? Is it inhibited at all?

No, this was direct current, there were always Uo (5V) over the coil. The current is inhibited by the voltage caused by Lenz law, only for a short amount of time when using direct current like on the picture, but if you are sending in pulses of voltage there is a sharp voltage spike created everytime.
i guess the second choke helps to inhibit the current, but i still don't get why meyer connected them opposing each other.



edited:

now after you mentioned hyiq, he has quite an interesting setup. 23.2Watts for this amount of hydrogen could be more than you'd normally get.
Is this a coil after the transformer? The black thing in the middle which is connected with 4 cables, 2 from the transformer, 2 to the cells.
(http://www.hyiq.org/Library/Images/HHO%20Cell3.jpg)

no current trough coil and all current through cap (but amps are choked), try to look for these properties.

that is not how current works. in series, the current is the same everywhere. the inductance (and so the resistance) of the coil has to be higher for a maximum of voltage raise at the cap.

Q = 1/R * (L/C)^0.5
Vresonance = (2*pi*(LC)^0.5)^-1

the smaller the capacitor the higher the voltage raise will be.

okay its 2am here so i might have made a mistake, but his effiency is over 90%.

2.1W (don't know exactly, but it's actually less than the 2.4Watt (look at overunity.com for explanation)  hours per litre is 100% energy conversion
he makes over 857 litres per hour with 2000Watt..


2000W/857l/h = 2.33Wh/l
Pretty close with brute force dc. Nice!

I sometimes wonder why there is so much focus on running a car with  HHO gas.  There are other more easily engineered applications.

Goey

exactly my thoughts! My goal would be a stationary generator which creates electricity from water. With the smart grid coming and electric cars being able to drive several hundred miles per charge with a motor efficiency of >90% it's the best solution to me. also size and weight of your hho generator don't matter when you put it in a shack at your home.

Goey
 
Steam.... It was not steam...lol.. and yes, it was AC, but i had to have a adjust the plate gap ( bigger gap than with DC ) so the overload protection in the inverter didn't start to beep and shut itself down. AC can indeed make HHO.
 
I am thinking of getting me a 1000W inverter... really blow the water out of the bucket

in which way does this help? you are probably creating hydrogen with a really bad efficiency then, but what do you gonna need it for? if you are going to use more electricity than gas use an electric car.

As far as i know you only pay for the real power at the plug anyway. the energy stored in inductive/capacitive elements isn't lost anyway and and recycled fully.

what i wanted to express was that if one makes a mistake that even high school kids would not make, the image is rather unlikely to contain useful or true information.

Terawatts of current, lol.

This says much of the credibility of the paper.

holy crap i just got my magnets. i purchased 8mm and 10mm diameter magnets. i wondered why it was so well packed with paper and more. instantly after getting the small ones out of the package they were attracted to the other magnets. the little ones got broken not a minute after unpacking, because they flew against a spoon and dropped to the floor. additionally i hurt two of my fingers, i didn't think these neodymium iron boron magnets were SO strong.  bought at magnetportal.de - the strongest magnets of the world. i guess they really are.

Looks like JLN is ahead of Steorn in delivering data: http://jnaudin.free.fr/steorn/indexen.htm#Loading

I'll probably try it. Of most free energy claims i have seen this are the most legitimate, although there are of course major flaws and unnecessarily long delays in supply with information on Steorns side. I'll definitely look into your Flynn documents.

The developer license is for legal purposes. Also for membership to the SKDB which tells you how to build it.
As far as i understood Naudin did only the first demos from Steorn, who knows if his machine is "overunity". The energy is not gained by rotation but by placing a similar toroid coil in the exact height line with the other coils, so that while voltage is induced there is no back emf anywhere. The important thing is that if you have a rotor with magnets or not it does not matter because the energy for the input coils is the same (no back emf). And the current you can get from the rotating rotor magnets induction is also without a back emf.
It does not matter if the pick up (which is for getting energy out of it) coil is near the rotor or not for the input energy. So if you know that the magnetic flux drops off proportional to 1/r² the only parameter for energy gain is the distance.
The reason for that simple shorting in the demonstration is the form of the induced currents and the size of the model. Not enough power for a light bulb and current not straight and defined enough for powering the generator itself or a led. They said that in the demo. Of course they could have used a rectifying circuit and some more but that would only raise more doubts, wouldn't it?

Is there a time limit to buying a developer kit?

Looks to me like the developer kit just lets you play with their computer software.

I would say build a device... JLN has enough clues there... then if it works and you want to start a company selling the stuff, then go and buy your development license.

Do they even have a patent? What is stopping you from just using the technology anyway?

It's Intellectual Property, something similar to a patent. The developer kit is a learning module with flash videos to present their intellectual property and make it understandable. The fee is mainly for the right to USE. Developer licenses don't allow to sell the product commercially, but that wouldn't be the problem if someone had a working device ready to sell he could buy a commercial license.
JLN is only working with information he got off the internet, as far as i know he does not have access to the skdb, which does not contain relevant information at the moment anyway. The whole thing should start after the test data is released - or should i say if it is released.
I'm waiting for the data and its evaluation and then if people generally think the skdb stuff is worth the price, i won't spend money without knowing the risk.

Of course if someone builds a replication and uses it at home nobody will know that he does not have a license to use it.  Again.. If..

Thanks i found phototransistors or optocouplers before. the way i understand it is that both led and photo-diode or transistor are inside a dark casing, both input and output are electrical. i can't think of a method to recognize e.g. a black/white difference or one revolution of a spinning device. probably with a led on the spinning part itself but that's not the case with naudin. there must be an existing part for that.

well i could use a laser pointer to shine onto the rotating part and install a little mirror on it so that every rotation the laser light is reflected onto a photo transistor. but seeing so many replications there must be an easier way 


after more research i found that the CNY70 will fit my needs.

yea but whats the name of this devices 

Does anyone know what type the optical sensors are which everyone uses? For example JNaudin here:
(http://jnaudin.free.fr/steorn/images/steornv3b.jpg)

I searched the internet for half an hour now without any part that i could use. Can anyone help? Naudins version seems to be an Integrated Circuit (IC), at least it looks like that in his schematics.