VIC pictures and Don's VIC notes..
Started by unknown · · 39 posts · last reply 3 August 2014
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#1 · date not recorded
Here are all the pictures i have of the VIC's of Meyer.
All are from Don Gable. Including his notes.
Steveattachment_13622 attachment_13624 attachment_13626 attachment_13628 attachment_13630 attachment_13632 attachment_13639 attachment_13641 attachment_13643 attachment_13645 attachment_13647 attachment_13651 attachment_13653 attachment_13655 attachment_13657 attachment_13659 attachment_13661 attachment_13663 attachment_13665 attachment_13667 attachment_13669 attachment_13671 attachment_13673 attachment_13675 attachment_13677 attachment_13679 attachment_13683 attachment_13685 attachment_13687 attachment_13689 attachment_13691 attachment_13695 attachment_13697 attachment_13699 attachment_13701 attachment_13703 attachment_13705 attachment_13707 attachment_13802 _ICT0008.JPG _ICT0009.JPG _ICT0010.JPG _ICT0016.JPG _ICT0019.JPG _ICT0020.JPG _ICT0035.JPG _ICT0056.JPG _ICT0059.JPG _ICT0081.JPG 4-23-2011 9_45_40 AM.JPG 4-23-2011 9_45_59 AM.JPG 4-23-2011 11_01_32 AM.JPG DSC_0025.jpg 4-23-2011 9_45_49 AM.png DSC_0039.jpg DSC_0043.jpg DSC_0107.jpg DSC_0131.jpg DSC_0132.jpg DSC_0133.jpg DSC_0141.jpg DSC_0142.jpg DSC_0143.jpg DSC_0194.jpg DSC_0218.jpg DSC_0220.jpg DSC_0219.gif DSC_0221.jpg DSC_0232.jpg DSC_0233.jpg IMG_8915.JPG IMG_8917.JPG meyers pics (1).JPG meyers pics (2).JPG meyers pics (3).JPG meyers pics (4).JPG meyers pics (6).JPG dons measurements picture.jpg
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#2 ·
I have some measurements to give you for the coils.
Using the above pictures as a referance the dementions are as followed.
The length of the large coils(left to right) 1.312 inches.
The width of the coils (top to bottom) 1.5 inches
The height of the coils(table up) 1.16 inches.
Coil base size measures .360 x .675 inches.
Length of small feedback coil (green) is.380 inches.
Wire size was 29 gauge .0115 inches.
My calculations for the primary wire is between 600-650 turns, wire resistance measured 10.5 ohms
Secondary 3000-3200 turns, wire resistance measured between 70-75 ohms between the three coils (2 chokes and secondary)
Now get busy
Don
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Quote from: Dynodon on 05 March 2011, 16:00:00
Kali'
Your way off with your turns.
Here's the resistance values that I took from the coils with a Fluke meter.
Primary-10.5 ohms
Secondary and chokes-70-75 ohms
Feedback-11.5 ohms
Now 29 gauge wire measures 81.83 ohms per 1000 feet,so I come up with the following
Primary- 128 feet
Secondary and chokes- 884 feet
As for number of turns I come up with
Primary - 600-650 turns
Secondary and chokes - 3000-3500 turns
Because they are hand wound and not precision,these should be very close.
As for the 220 ohm resister,they were wired across the primary to restrict the current feeding it.10.5 ohms will make the coil heat up with 12 volts feeding it.Some of the coil pacts had three resistors across the primary,all of them were 220 ohm.The largest one was a 5 watt.
Don
Quote from: Dynodon on 06 March 2011, 16:22:44
The 220 ohm resistors were like I said wired across the primary coil(parallel).A friend had talked with a coil manufacture,and they told him that 10.5 ohms coil would get hot,then he asked them what would happen if you were to wire a 220 ohm resistor across it,and he stated that it would run cooler.Not my words.
As for the NVR1550 diode,there is actually a MUR1550 and a MUR1560.The first is a 500 volt,and the second was a 600 volt.
Kali,as for your explaination of the voltage step up up 1:5 with 12 volts in and 60 volts out was a little confusing.But I believe I understand what you were getting at.
You are stating that if you apply 12 volts to the primary coil,with a step up ratio of 1:5 you will then get 60 volts out to the blocking diode.Now in my testing of my coils,I have a step up ratio of 1:10 or as I would put it 10:1.So if I apply 12 volts to my primary I should get 120 volts out of the secondary.Right?
Well when I test the output of my secondary without any load on it,I get a much greater step up than 10:1.I've seen several hundred volts.No just maybe that is what Stan is hoping for with his set up.Maybe because we are restricting amps with the choke coils that this high voltage from our secondary is able to stay high,because of the very low load.
Under normal step up coils we are appling loads to the secondary output which pulls the voltage down to the actual ratio of the steup.So just maybe with the chokes restricting the amps,we are able to keep this higher voltage than the stepup ratio produces.Maybe it has something to do with the coils all being on the same core that allows this greater voltage to be produce.
Now again with my coil set up,of 100 turns primary,1000 turns secondary,and 2000 turns chokes,I have seen between 1kv-2kv at the cell.It it hasn't had any ill effect on the blocking diode.And my diode is the same rating as a MUR1560.
Thats some of my thoughts on this matter as I have seen it with my own testing.
Don
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Quote from: TonyWoodside on 01 April 2011, 08:17:24
Primary : 450 turns, 10?, Air Inductance 1.43mH, Core Inductance 8.01mH
Feedback : 450 turns, 10?, Air Inductance 2.98mH, Core Inductance 10.4mH
Secondary : 3000 turns, 78.2?, Air Inductance 87.2mH, Core Inductance 358mH
L1 : 3000 turns, 75.9?, Air Inductance 83.1mH, Core Inductance 359mH
L2 : 3000 turns, 76.9?, Air Inductance 85.5mH, Core Inductance 359mH
So the secondary side total inductance is 1076mH
My testing coils are as follows:
Prim. 850uH 1ohm 200wnd AWG23 (100ohm series resistor) coil former 35mm length max.30mm height
Sec. 150mH 46ohm 2000wnd AWG30 coil former 35mm length max.30mm height
Pickup center tapped 2x 15mH 2x11ohm 2x500wnd AWG30 coil former 20mm length max.30mm height
Choke1 150mH 46ohm 2000wnd AWG30 coil former 35mm length max.30mm height
Choke2 150mH 46ohm 2000wnd AWG30 coil former 35mm length max.30mm height
core hole 10x8mm
Copper wire insulation should sustain 2k5Volt.
Inductance depends on core material used (measured values are without core)
Going to try ferrite core ( UU core )
My wfc cell is insulated in delrin. Wires are fully insulated.
It is 2Mega Ohms 1.8nF.
br,
Webmug
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The core is a Ferroxcube U core,the largest one they make.The legs are @ 3/4 inch in diameter.
The chokes are in the 10-11 Henries ech,very high.
So......as Don once said, go testing!
Steve -
#3 · date not recorded
I´m really confuse... since this primary numbers should not allow more than 0,5 amp at the primary...
The 220ohm resistor impede the development of too high voltage at the primary that would burn the transistor...
3 resistors in parallel sums 73ohms...
I was wandering if it was a hipersil C core... -
#4 · date not recorded
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#5 · date not recorded
Here is something I'll share with everyone. Work toward this. It's only pulling .02 - .01ma at 14 volts from the power supply to get this voltage.attachment_13715 Capture222.PNG
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#6 · date not recorded
Here is something I'll share with everyone. Work toward this. It's only pulling .02 - .01ma at 14 volts from the power supply to get this voltage.
nice data....
thanks for sharing
impressive from such a low power.. -
#7 · date not recorded
Stans core of the VIC dimensions:
Single u core = 0,27cm thick by 6,25cm wide by 6,92cm high by 1,07cm diam.....
2 u cores make 1 set for the VIC
Material: probably ferrite.
permeability +- 2,500
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#8 · date not recorded
Got one more shot, after tuning my coils a little more today, I got the full potential out of my VIC. Been running now fro over an hour now and everything is still running cold coils, transistors, ect. I think I will quit while I'm ahead. LOLattachment_13717 Capture223.PNG
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#9 · date not recorded
Got one more shot, after tuning my coils a little more today, I got the full potential out of my VIC. Been running now fro over an hour now and everything is still running cold coils, transistors, ect. I think I will quit while I'm ahead. LOL
Ron,
What kind of core are you using?
Can i buy it somewhere?
Steve -
#10 · date not recorded
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#11 ·
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#12 ·
Sure can, http://www.aliexpress.com/snapshot/231356182.html
Thanks Ron.
The shape is different then the Meyer cores.
Is this the one you use with primary, secondairy, chokes and measure coils?
cheers
Steve -
#13 ·
I use a little different concept than Stan did, but still does the same thing. I put two coils on one set of cores and two coils on another set of cores. -
#14 ·
Thanks R.Walker,
I was trying to do that messing up with the coupling but is much harder...
Incredible
could you explain a little about what you believe is the effect of using this bucking fields?
Just another silly question... the size of the cell matters? I mean you can get the same effect on the 9 tube cell and at the resonant cavity setup with the same trafo setup? just varying the signal frequency and voltage level of both transformers?
Of course i´m assuming you are using two transformers to adjust the relation between the voltages in the secondary and chokes separately
I´m sure you drank the same water we did =)
regard that the saying in this drawing is:
5) Secondary coil winding (8 ) resonant charging chokes (9/12) of similar size and length sets up "Electron Bounce " zone by which the displaced electrons forms copper ions moving and taking on a positive electrical charge entering into resonant charging choke (9); Whereas, the clustering of electrons at resonant charging choke (12) forms negative voltage polarity of opposite electrical polarity intensity.attachment_13719 S.Meyer - RPG.jpg
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#15 · date not recorded
I use a little different concept than Stan did, but still does the same thing. I put two coils on one set of cores and two coils on another set of cores.
Ok, Ron.
The 2 core sets are not hooked up to eachother?
Stacked on top of each other?
Cheers!
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#16 · date not recorded
Thanks R.Walker,
I was trying to do that messing up with the coupling but is much harder...
Incredible
could you explain a little about what you believe is the effect of using this bucking fields?
Just another silly question... the size of the cell matters? I mean you can get the same effect on the 9 tube cell and at the resonant cavity setup with the same trafo setup? just varying the signal frequency and voltage level of both transformers?
Of course i´m assuming you are using two transformers to adjust the relation between the voltages in the secondary and chokes separately
I´m sure you drank the same water we did =)
regard that the saying in this drawing is:
5) Secondary coil winding (8 ) resonant charging chokes (9/12) of similar size and length sets up "Electron Bounce " zone by which the displaced electrons forms copper ions moving and taking on a positive electrical charge entering into resonant charging choke (9); Whereas, the clustering of electrons at resonant charging choke (12) forms negative voltage polarity of opposite electrical polarity intensity.
He, Fabio,
Electron bouncing now finally creates a picture in my brain........ yes the gray thing existing from 2 cells in my head....
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#17 ·
this phrases are still resonating in my mind...
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#18 ·
Ron advised to focus on the primary.
After some research i ended by by flyback type transformers who function a bit different then normal transformers.
http://www.ionizationx.com/index.php/topic,2890.msg26982/topicseen.html#msg26982
The term "Flyback Transformer" is a little misleading and its more useful to consider it as coupled inductors rather than a transformer because the action is quite different with a conventional transformer energy is going into the primary and out of the secondary at the same time it does not store energy. With a "Flyback" transformer energy is first stored then released.
So, the approuch for the vic system of Ron, must be using gaps between the cores..
Ron, i just orderd some of your recommanded cores and will use them like flyback,s..
See what comes out of it ☺☺
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#19 ·
Cores with an air gap are needed to achieve the highest Q factor and temperature stability.....
I rest my case.... -
#20 · date not recorded
I just got the other day some 220ohm 5w resistors
and some 29awg wire..
Steve do you remember how many turns we were guessing there was in the vics?
if i remember well maybe over 2000 turns for each coil and 600 for the primary isn´t it?
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#21 · date not recorded
Steve i have only one regard about your flyback idea, the flyback generates high voltage during the pulse off, while stan says that diode stays like a switch in a open position during pulse off or i´m confusing it?
except your talking about having the chokes to receive the pulse... correct? -
#22 · date not recorded
Switching diode (55) of Figure (3-22) not only acts as a blocking diode by preventing electrical "shorting" to secondary coil (52) during pulse off-time (69) of Figure (3-20) since diode (55) "only" conducts electrical energy in the direction of schematic arrow; but, also, and at the same time functions as a electronic switch which opens electrical circuit (60) during pulse offtime ... allowing magnetic fields of both inductor coils (56/57) to collapse ... forming pulse train (64a xxx 64n).
that could mean that at this point the cell is already positively charged and can't discharge into the secondary since it forms a open circuit...
collapse is a work for fast rate of decrease or just a synonym of decrease? -
#23 · date not recorded
I just got the other day some 220ohm 5w resistors
and some 29awg wire..
Steve do you remember how many turns we were guessing there was in the vics?
if i remember well maybe over 2000 turns for each coil and 600 for the primary isn´t it?
Please read my previous posts in this topic.
I followe Dons measurements. Primary ca 600 windings aka 10.5 ohms....
In the pictures you also find the driver of Stan for the vic. It has a diode over the primary.
No resistor.
However, maybe both might work.....
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#24 · date not recorded
Steve i have only one regard about your flyback idea, the flyback generates high voltage during the pulse off, while stan says that diode stays like a switch in a open position during pulse off or i´m confusing it?
except your talking about having the chokes to receive the pulse... correct?
the secondairy coil discharges into the 3000 windings choke coils.....
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#25 · date not recorded
you mean 3000 each choke?
The resistor in parallel with the diode would just help throwing away power so probably is in series with the diode isn´it?
this may serve to allow the fields to collapse based on the secondary coupling rather than the primary since the primary becomes a 80resistor. during switch off, assuming what i´m saying is correct;;