How To Increase High Volts Of Lawn Mower Ignition Coil?
Started by unknown · · 19 posts · last reply 18 August 2025
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#1 ·
An Inverter with ac output could operate primary of a regular type Ignition transformer , so as then,a voltage multiplier could be used. The current mower engines have a built in epoxied solid state trigger for the final MAGNETRON , 3 terminal autotransformer, so as it is a one piece unit. The original type was called a MAGNETO as just a transformer that worked with points contacts and condenser capacitor. Then came the same MAGNETO that could be used with an accessory trigger module , either Briggs brand or the universal type trigger module which was better, as engine would start at less cranking speed.
Another idea of mine was to ADD stronger magnets to the curved ALNICO magnet embedded in rim of flywheel. Magnets are not made as exact curve of flywheel. Therefore the only way is to use thin type , vertical, NEODYMIUM magnets super glued onto the existing one so as north pole faces outward that is .012" from MAGNETRON core laminations. This is called armature gap. The thin sideways measure has less of a curve for each one! I succesfully tested this theory on hand made spinning wood flywheel that fires a magnetron/magneto with trigger. Resulting high volts actual readings were not measured. I was also able to switch to a Positive high volts , rather than regular negative high volts with positive ground. (Upside down ignition coil) Ok If magneto with separate trigger, but not Briggs brand complete Magnetron. (The MAGNETRON coil using the universal type trigger will operate both polarities- but not the older style Briggs brand. ) See different photos of both types. On very old lawnmowers, the smaller flywheel had 2 magnets of both north and south poles firing the ignition coil with AC, with breaker points and condensor.
Some older cars had what was called HEI high energy ignition coils with outputs of 23-60,000volts. The mower ignition firing is only 10kv under compression , 6kv in air, and needs to be greatly increased in voltage for use with alternate energy projects that need a pre-type PLASMA PATH across spark plug, as the much higher voltage HEI units already do. How do you think this should be done. I am not an engineer.
The Briggs ignition coil (armature) gets about 1-1.6 amps induced into it, at about 5-8 volts, from the spinning flywheel magnet. The system shorts, to put out back EMF of -140volts. I propose using primary connection of 12v DC with resistance so as limiting current DC, but higher than normal. Resulting magnetic field should be higher. It will also short to ground with trigger as usual. Also several technicians have added capacitance with auto ignition primary coil inductance , so as raising the operating frequency of entire transformer, and increasing efficiency and higher voltage, due to being closer to the resonant frequency of transformer itself. No one has mentioned this about lawnmower coils. There are ignition boosters for sale but they are electric. Most riding lawn mower engines use a magnet for ignition, and 12 magnets for battery charging with enclosed ring alternator- only the crankshaft has to turn. A standard Lawn mower engine cannot be used for an alternate energy project without some way of greatly increaing the output voltage.l The Last resort is the conversion to car coil HEI, or adding to spark plug what is commonly called "Peaking Capacitor " of 100pf at 30KV,- which works, but dangerous to humans. The parallel spark capacitor has slightly raised up gas mileage of car owners with slight gain in power.
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#2 ·
Other methods to increase ignition voltage can be insertion into a pulse type, step up transformer, laminations type, with the ratio desired . Since ignition is just pulse voltage out one direction and not AC, the common multiplier circuit can't be used. The other method is to add accessory spark gap with attached PF capacitors in and hooked to air core copper coils transformer of about 1:3 ratio. (Small voltage type Tesla coil / Tesla hair pin circuit with Radiant Energy) The reasoning behind this , is that the lawn mower SS ignition coil (Magnetron) is only 10kv and not strong enough voltage to perform PLASMA PATH for the expected DC current injection into spark plug. S1R9A9M9 - Nathren and his tech people either did that Tesla circuit, or just used a PF PEAKING CAPACITOR . But that is a very short time constant compared with ignition volts. The whole idea was to allow extended time constant for about 34% ON TIME of circuit not just near TDC.This allows more DC current contact with water and water vapor . The 1978 car got 18MPG on water but was using HEI as about 28KV from high energy ignition chevy coil in top of distributor cap, as good Plasma Path. My bench project has small board with inverter to DC high frequency type with bridge rectification charging 47Uf cap with 200v output through 15kv block microwave diode. This is against the ignition high volts output , so as not having to increase the original 10KV. The cap discharges with Radiant Energy allowing plasma path. ( An increase of string series protection diodes bank requires much more input draw current and wattage from input battery.) It's best to keep the ignition volts at a lower level. -
#3 · date not recorded
The original Magnetron engine coil was changed to a DUAL cable ignition type that was for a 2cyl Briggs engine, and used on my Briggs 1 cyl 12HP. That one has a complete separate secondary. (Briggs 2 spark plug engines can have both single and double Magnetrons) This way the neg cable can go to ground and the +pos cable goes to spark plug. This is for using a positive type spark. The other 2 methods of positive spark have a large loss of output voltage due to being an Autotransformer type with prim as part of the sec side. I also super glued on several thin 20mm length neodymium magnets on the flywheel magnet to get stronger output high voltage. I also added ring type neodymium magnet on spark plug so as there is a guaranteed magnetic field at plug tips. Currently reworking the homemade vacuum box for spark processor as diode, L coil 1.5Mh , 221PF 30kv capacitor, and Tesla magnetic spark gap with N + S button neodymium magnets opposite Tesla type carbon and aluminum electrodes gaped about 5mm.. This is used in conjunction with the S1R9A9M9 triple coils assembly so there is the required accessory spark gap on lawn mower engine. Engine under compression has higher voltage needed than in air. Therefore the protection series diode bank needs to be about 25-30KV fast diodes capable of 6 amps minimum. The S1r coils have insulated Magnet wire #12 gauge , that is acted upon by amps magnetic field coils over it so as the spark time is extended from 0-neg 34degrees late timing. (See design method on internet images and the one called Megatran.
The 1978 V8 that ran on water in carb had the HEI ignition coil that's mounted in top of distributor switched around so as the 2 wires on primary side was set for POSITIVE high v. output from ignition coil. They said about 24000volts at 6-7 amps through spark plug needed. The generated water vapor pressure along with hydrogen gas electrolysis kept engine self running and then got 18miles per gallon with water in tank. The original car engine tests in Georgia 2005 - on, used this following circuit that was part of the dual coil relays in vacuum per cylinder. Diode half wave DC for about 45 volts DC to junction to l inductor about 1.5Millihenty, to joint of hi v. input to L coil inductor 1.5Mh to diode to spark plug. There was a bypass diode at 1st junction over to spark plug. Wire went from exact bottom of spark plug back to diode to return line to power supply inverter. 400W 110v AC , 60cycles, type called power on board.The 60 cycles relays were in vacuum + extra diodes mounted on outside screw terminals. I made the processor box to replace THE UNAVAILABLE RELAYS. The 3 technicians back then called them "The Magic Relays", since other replacements did not wok, or were not efficient to run engine smoothly. They also found out that EGR engines ran way better, due to the recycled Nitrogen from the exhaust. I studied the now closed website. Questions? -
#4 · date not recorded
Another method of increasing lawn mower high voltage is to add a series spark gap in line with the spark plug. The plug in air gap of 1mm is about 3KV. Under compression of Briggs engine , that would be multiplied by about 5 as 15KV. The compression ratio is 5.8 to 1, as squeezing more air into smaller space. The spark plug will not increase in volts after compression if the load stays the same. The 2 spark gap voltages will add together, making the ignition coil (Magnetron) raise up to a higher level ! This higher ignition volts can THEN be used with the S1R9A9M9 triple coils assembly to be able to get a higher crossover leakage induction voltage that would be in series with the main amps line, with the low volts, going to spark plug. The electrolyte salt water at plug gap needs a higher volts (100-200v) to be able to force 6-7 amps THROUGH the spark plug . The water solution at the spark plug gap is NOT zero ohms, and is about 22 ohms. Formula E needed voltage = R X I. ( Electrolysis of water at engine spark plug to get sufficient Hydrogen to run engine at idle speed at a lower power level.) Nathren's earlier web forum had various tech data that was gleaned before it shut down. -
#5 ·
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Thread Starter
russwr
I need a circuit for using only a standard lawn mower Briggs magnetron to increase high voltage output to 24,000volts! The flywheel magnet instills 5-8v PULSE ONLY, trigger shorts the primary to ground, then back EMF creates negative -130 volts to run the secondary side for negative 12,000volts. The primary is very low .2 ohm resistance. The metal core end connects to ground for secondary side and trigger side, + the trigger connects primary to ground. The open tab terminal is accessible for primary wiring . Can this be attached to 12 volts DC to superimpose on the 5-8volts, to get a higher secondary output? How? Mower ignition is called autotransformer with 3 terminals only. The aftermarket solid state trigger module called Stens operates when the voltage is indicated going into primary from the North pole magnet. The internal transistor switches on temporarily to ground. This connection maybe could be used for another transistor to instill 12v DC superimposed onto the magnet voltage. This would then instill a higher back EMF that runs secondary side for higher, high voltage. Also, a different burst oscillator mode, for single pulse desired, could be used and then shut down by the trigger. Maybe the 12v DC has to be triggered in, so that it doesn't short the primary winding to burn out. That's the problem. Ideas??? I have magnetic hall switches to operate a transistor to switch in the 12 volts. ( A voltage doubler circuit requires only AC input) The small unit being sold for autos is a high frequency oscillator that raises also up to 16 volts pulse to the ignition, - was called firestorm for as $8 to $75. A man in England on YouTube was adding parallel capacitor to TV fly back primary to raise up high voltage as the resonant frequency of wire and ferrite core is way higher, and run from high frequency oscillator.
I already tried increasing magnetic field by adding neodymium multiple magnets on top of North pole magnet with no volts increase. ((After 1982, The Briggs ignition coil had built in solid state transistor and trigger coil under the epoxy, and then all are called MAGNETRONS. - Uses same name as the glass tube oscillator in a microwave oven.)) The other model ignition Magnetron, with 2 ignition cables, has secondary side not connected to primary side. That dual cylinders Briggs engine fired one side negative high volts while the other spark plug fired positive high volts. The system is still single pulsed based,- NOT AC.
The way earlier pre-1982 Briggs ignitions were called MAGNETO with points + condenser, that used plain autotransformer without any solid state. I had earlier contemplated to add a south pole magnet next to North pole one, to get AC to run the Primary of a MAGNETO transformer, and use double universal triggers with blocking diodes to get it to run. Only then, can the common AC voltage multiplier be used to increase the high voltage on the secondary side. That is also still a primary+ secondary auto transformer system. If that was used , the secondary side has reduced high voltage, as the metal core has to be mounted upside down to get positive high volts. - The primary is not then part of the secondary when fired. Any ideas?
Attachmentsattachment_17072 attachment_17074 attachment_17076 attachment_17078 Briggs Magnetron Ignition.jpg Briggs trigger magnetron coil.jpg Stens trigger module.jpg Briggs Magneto -only transformer before 1982.jpg
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#6 · date not recorded
Another possible method to increase mower engine high voltage is to add a Hall effect sensor circuit that senses the North pole field of the flywheel rotating magnet near the magnetron, and use the output pulse to turn on Mosfet for 12 volts dc to go to the tab terminal on the engine coil. That terminal is connected to primary, and is normally used to shut off the mower engine by the ground connection. Insertion of FAST12 volts superimposed on the 5-8v from magnet would increase the back EMF generated, higher than -130v, so that the secondary side gets higher, high volts output. A unipolar Hall, 3 pins, on the small board would have the leads bent u shaped so that the hall head faces backwards. This would allow the North pole to turn on the switch. After magnet passes by, the circuit shuts off. Mosfet power switch is way faster than a small relay to allow battery volts on to the Primary coil. A 3 ohm resistor would be put in series with the .2 ohm primary coil, so as about 4 amps flows, higher than the usual 3 amps.of primary ignition on a Briggs lawnmower engine.
It was assumed that 24000 volts is required for the engine conversion, along with the equal or greater than 100volts cross leakage induction volts to push 6 amps through the spark plug water cell of about 23ohms, to get the hydrogen fuel and water vapor pressure at retarded timing -34degrees. -
#7 ·
Hi Russ,
Can you try to explain in steps how all this should be able to work?
Most of us tried the waterdrops and sparkplug setup.
What s different with this one?
cheers! -
#8 ·
What's different with this set up by S1R9A9M9? How is this not like other set-ups for spark plug firing water that was tried?
The three technicians in Georgia 2005-2013 and Nathren, who was MOSTLY observing, decided to operate engines on water to hydrogen gas and water vapor pressure, without a separate built electrolysis cell.
1. The water has to be an electrolyte, - such as salt water or baking soda, not plain water.
2. The injection of current has to be limited to 6-7 amps DC. (Fast visual only done with an oscilloscope for pulses) or analog meter with needle. Higher current burns away electrodes.
3. Resistor such as 1 ohm used on ground side of spark plug tested with probes across resistor, so as scope not damaged. I = voltage read divided by resistance across one resistor in series.
4. The circuit must be in milliseconds, not microseconds.
5. Capacitor discharges through spark plug are in microseconds.
6. A circuit with plug that has low voltage 6 amps flow with amp gauge and series variable resistor pre set for 6A ,will show 6 on meter when plug is shorted to ground with screwdriver for a full connection. But when plug gap changed to electrolyte, the gauge drops to 1 tenth amp flow. A regular electrolysis cell needs sufficient square inches surface area metal at a low voltage. The spark plug tips are tiny and require much higher volts to push the same current. The electrical load has increased to 10-22 ohms. Therefore, a higher voltage 100v and higher is necessary to push 6 amps through spark plug. The triple wire coils assembly of S1R9A9M9 has a 5 turns Ignition bare wire that induces into #14 gauge insulated wire a greater voltage from crossover leakage induction volts. The unit was called Electromagnet and Booster coil. This was to replace the dual L coils of the specialized relays per cylinder that were used on all the previous car engine conversions along with the main Inverter box 110v AC to half wave DC.
7. The high voltage line requires inductor L of about 1.75millihenry to help with the reduction of spark speed. ( wire on insulated plastic bobbin holder only) (60 cycles coil at .6 ohm reactance of L, as 1.75Millihenry, - coil of original relay)
8. The timing of engine for smoother running requires late timing , ATDC of about 34 degrees negative.
9. The factory Briggs engine was preset at TDC, so as the Electromagnet allowed the spark time to extend onward from zero to about 34 degrees late.
10. The timing point at lower piston travel allows water as volatile by the suction effect to be acted upon to expand to vapor pressure for additional pressure for piston.
11. The magnetic field effect follows wires and increases efficiency, and is at spark plug tips . Magnetic field reduces spark plug speed also as it is wrapped over plug wire.
12. The ignition voltage wire enters in exactly at the point of the cathode of diode/diodes protection bank.
13. Electricity always wants to follow direction of the least resistance. DC Ignition attempts abruptly to pass through the ON DIODE backwards, as it senses a ground that way. The diode fast closes off, and ignition compresses , then releases back to do the EFFORT of JUMPING spark plug gap. This diode/ignition event releases RADIANT ENERGY that follows to spark plug tips.
14. Ignition DC volts on previous cars were about 24,000 volts. Lawn mower engine Magnetron volts is lower, but can be adjusted upward with an in series, accessory, adjustable spark gap The car engines converted all had 2-3 spark gaps in series,- distributor rotor gap, relay contacts gap, and spark plug gap. .The compression effect on spark plug also causes Ignition coils to increase output volts.
15. Ignition polarity is to match the polarity of the current added to the circuit.
16. MANY fast recovery type diodes required for wiring circuit FR607.
17. Placement of parts in certain order for higher volts of crossover, as Ignition coil to diode blocks, to S1R coils, to accessory spark gap, to insertion point last cathode, to inductor, to diode to spark plug. (the 2 spark gaps in series have voltage drops) Higher volts wanted on the crossover point .
18. Nathren said that other wiring design coils would work too. I assumed he meant the 5 turn bare wire #12, to be wound in parallel instead, together, wound, with 5-7 turns #14 insulated type for higher crossover volts. (The 90 degrees regular S1R type wind would stifle some of the transfer volts). This then, would have core steel long screw
underneath for better magnetic induction effect.
19. The engine selected should have EGR valve or EGR added with adjustable valve to obtain the embedded Nitrogen from exhaust which allows smoother running engine.
20. Spark plug changed to one with same reach length, mm size, and with no internal resistor as an "R". A comparable R type as a Champion brand, can be put in vise with torch heated top screw cap removed , so as resistor is removed and replaced with copper wire segment #12. Now as zero ohms spark plug/ racing plug. This now allows current to pass through.
21. Briggs Brand used riding mower engine, 8-20HP can have alternator ring removed and changed for higher amps output, such as dual yellow wires type or dual black wires type, and also changed flywheel so as the underneath magnets are large instead of the small type. See photos Ebay. Start engine with power supply, then recharge battery with ring alternator.or underneath car alternator added on. Nathren and the Georgia shop technicians ran mower engine on just alternator without battery connected. Battery was used for circuit initial power only and the starter motor, then completely removed. The Briggs 18hp was self running on Briggs alternator only at a lower RPM.
See again the S1R9A9M9 (2) YouTube videos by Nathren and son. , -
#9 ·
I finally found a reference on how to increase ignition high volts, quite easily, like Nathren-S1R9A9M9 did, from lawn mower Magnetron output. Data is from 2008, where poster Capacitor70 placed several notes regarding the method. It has to do with adding in 3 capacitors and firing a mounted ADJUSTABLE TYPE SPARK PLUG TESTER The wiring hooks to a 2 1/4" Diam gray ferrite torroid core FT240-31 as step up transformer with 8 + 24 turns. The secondary side hooks to the main spark plug, and also the additional power supply amps. The transformer wires should be insulated high voltage silicone cables. I am using white 30kv and red 30kv. Winding directions polarity have to be figured. (Automotive ignitions are usually quite high in volts, contrary to lawn mower engine's Magnetron). A Briggs Magnetron is a pre1982 Magneto with a solid state trigger module epoxied in, and is all a one-piece unit. Total capacitance in series as less than 1000pf at 6kv to 24kv total. Has to do with speed of resonance of Primary L and C. Suggested use was 2200pf+3900pf+7500pf. Use electronics formula for capacitors in series. The transformer will work for both negative and positive high voltage. While High V is going, must slowly adjust the first gap, to get the second gap to fire. EAY purchase orders less costly than Amazon that has minimum $35 order for no shipping charge. Some separate electronics companies have a minimum dollar order plus shipping plus sales tax. Someone back at that time had converted a Volvo 4cyl car engine to water, using the toroid method. Capacitor70 converted 3 different motorcycle engines that ran on water in carbs.HE said the new method was better than string of series diodes that overheats and melts the solder joints. (I don't see this toroid as any protection for main power supply.) He said there is an isolation factor. I also don't really believe it was just coincidence that the (2) S1R engine demonstrations came out in the same time summer 2008 as the capacitor70 tech data! Several drawings on Internet are wrong for the spark plug hook up for capacitor70 circuit. SEE THE ACTUAL TOROID CORE PICTURE FOR ORIGINAL USED AS GREEN WIRE HOOKED TO ACCESSORY FIRST SPARK PLUG TOP! The higher turns brown magnet wire is secondary step up as volts 1:3. The secondary side should hook to spark plug top and ground, CONTRARY TO THE OTHER INTERNET DRAWINGS. The circuit will allow for PLASMA PATH for the following amps injection.See other notes about the S1Rcoils as an actual hand wound step down transformer ratio 13:7, to use the low amps pulsing DC from output of dual alternators ring, to raise it up to flow the 10amps as stated., when only at idling RPM. The 7 turns wound same way as 13 turns, requires the steel nail/screw core underneath for proper magnetic field. The exterior extension cord that's split in the videos, allows connection to ground exactly at spark plug ground. Ground point same as for both 1st spark gap and tap to ground for S1R coils.The elecromagnet also provides the needed field that EXTENDS the spark time - slows it down from 0 to to minus 34 degrees proper late timing. A separate coil L of about 1.75 Millihenry is also in the high voltage line for further time extension. (Car battery first allows current, then removed.) The plastic sealed deli tub on side of Briggs engine contained BOTH the S1r coils assembly + the step up high voltage pulse transformer with spark gap and capacitors. Nathren had said there were no capacitors used. He was untrained and ignorant, and was thinking about CONDENSERS - the old wording. The three actual technicians in Georgia workshop designed and built all the circuits,- not him. He said so. All this has to do with electrolysis at spark plug for hydrogen gas and water vapor pressure for self running engine, as was shown on Youtube video - S1R9A9M9 (2) videos and Nathren's now shut down web forum.attachment_17119 attachment_17121 attachment_17123 attachment_17125 attachment_17127 attachment_17129 attachment_17131 Cap 70 drawing.jpg Capacitor70 Actual Toroid step up pulse High V. transformer.jpg Briggs alternator.jpg S1R original coil used running engine.jpg Inverter 500Watts.jpg Bridge Rectifier.jpg AC voltage regulator.jpg
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#10 · date not recorded
Ok, so as of now, there are only about four questions left unanswered regarding the S1R9A9M9 wiring set up on the Briggs 18HP mower engine.
1.-- Why wasn't the same 400 Watt Inverter box used, as was on all the other many earlier car/tractor engine conversions? 110v AC with half wave or full wave rectification. Resistance in circuit is required for 10 amps. The spark plug electrolyte was about 10-22 ohms. There were MANY series diode voltage drops in the autos circuit schematic. The dual coils relay used per cylinder, in the cars, was about 1.2 ohms total of #21 gauge wire. Nathren said that it couldn't be used on mower engine ,as it came in at a frequency and would just bog down and shut off. If he tried to hook it up himself instead of the real technicians, then he didn't know what he was doing. The change over was then done with car 12v battery. -----Possibility as ,- an Inverter box will bog down exactly when the starter motor is turned on , while using the SAME battery. Over 50 amps draw will reduce initial battery volts that the Inverter needs. The earlier Georgia car engine conversions , all used a 2nd. accessory battery for the conversion circuits.
2.- Why did Nathren mention many times in his Forum that 100 volts and 10 amps was required to get an engine to start and run on water to hydrogen fuel gas. Did he, as ignorant, mean that he was talking about the 110v Inverter box? He also should have known that all the earlier engines were running on 6-7 amps per cylinder only ,as per the technicians. (garage oscilloscope and hand meters) Salt water Electrolyte at plug tips as about 10 ohms resistance.
3.-Why wasn't EGR applied on lawn mower engine for the 2 demonstrations of summer 2008. EGR with recirculated Nitrogen from exhaust smooths out the earlier engines tested idling RPMS. Adjustable valves were added for control on the cars.
4.- If the increased high voltage from the Capacitor70 circuit provided that proper Plasma Path to allow heavy amps transfer through spark plug, then what was the Bare 5 turns copper #12 gauge coil be used for in that S1R triple coils assembly? Was that needed too? (crossover leakage inductance voltage, I tested, (90-200v) After being miffed ,I then decided that what might have happened, is this,--- After the 2008 demonstrations were over, Nathren clipped off the ground wire that was hooked to the extension cord. That left a stub wire in the black electrical tape with frayed wires you can see in the graph paper photograph. Blow it up to see. He then unwound the proper parallel 7 turns from the secondary side and rewound them directly over the bare copper wire as a 90 degree wind. Now there is no transformer effect as no steel core underneath 7 turns. Do you agree? Nathren was attempting to hide the pertinent data from the public. The final photo as on the graph paper is the converted one as shown to the public. What do you think?
5.- Why didn't Nathren run the mower engine on just battery power continuously, with the addition of alternator voltage. There are 2 halves of alternator with (2) AC outputs. Battery was used for starter motor and initial circuit start up circuit, so as engine was idling at lower RPM. Battery was completely removed for some reason. (Besides the high volts being on the battery as danger, no safety) The alternator is just wires with rectifier pulses. The extra wire on the starter terminal, going around back of engine, also ran the main circuit when the red positive battery cable clip touched it. Maybe the technicians wanted mower engine to also be self running, just like the V8 on engine stand in their shop running 24 hours-7days, with large generator attached, and water line. - Free electricity for shop. -
#11 ·
Many questions open.
The most important one why he didnt do more with that finding....is it?
If yu have such a nice finding, you do more with it, is it?
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#12 · date not recorded
The only way to increase the high volts of lawnmower Magnetron ignition coil, is to bolt on another piece of laminations with a wire coil. The output of 1st secondary will be added to the next coil as an extension. The same magnetic flux is there, same time. There are differences in ignitions of the past . Some have higher secondary Henry inductance and ohms resistance, meaning there would be slightly higher output ignition volts. It is way less costly to experiment with small engines , but they need 24kv minimum for plasma path for amperage to pass, and must be in milliseconds time, not microseconds as in C D I.
A much more involved method is a second, opposite pole magnet put on flywheel next to other one with an opposite balancing lead weight. The dual magnetos would make AC into primary of the "old" style plain transformer type ignition . The secondary side AC generated could then use the diode and capacitor voltage doubler. The STENS brand aftermarket trigger modules work with either polarity ignitions. 2 blocking diodes would also be needed.
A man on You tube video tests his Biggs Magnetrons coils on bench with AC activated coils on old shaver laminations mounted next to the ignition laminations. The transposing magnetic flux runs the main ignition coil for spark. (trigger not tested)
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#13 ·
There are options when selecting a replacement ignition coil (Magnetron) for the mower engine. I was interested in changing over to positive high voltage rather than normal negative high voltage. There are a couple reasons. When tinkering with small engine for alternate uses/ fuels, There are high voltage shocks received when connecting parts such as resistor, capacitor, L coil, to engine ground. The spark plug refuses to fire, and bypasses to go up another line such as parts. During that time we get shocks from the engine. Also, when using the original old style Magneto as just a plain transformer before 1982, you can put it upside down on engine bracket and get positive high volts, but at away reduced level. You don't get up to 15kv anymore. The Autotransformers normally have the primary coil hooked directly with secondary side. The full secondary is normally primary + secondary in a negative "mode" Less wire is used in the positive mode.
Now then, there actually is a better way to get positive type high voltage at FULL VALUE VOLTS! If your Briggs engine is a one cylinder type, you can purchase a modern replacement Magnetron with DOUBLE CABLES. The secondary side is not connected with primary. When used on the twin cylinder engines, each spark plug gets different type power. Negative on one side and positive on other cylinder. Also, if you get the most modern type dual cables Magnetron, it will have the better type built in UNIVERSAL type trigger , rather than the Briggs brand trigger. Engine will fire at a lower RPM of flywheel , just like in the "olden days". Just hook the negative cable to ground and the positive cable to spark plug. Compare the photos of armature Magnetrons on Ebay to see the difference.
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#14 ·
Another few methods to note regarding increasing existing level of lawn mower high voltage output. Add another complete Magnetron to the left coil mount , with longer screw, so as the iron laminations are bolted to the laminations underneath, for same timing. The flywheel outer magnet will induce magnetism in both cores same time. The first regular output cable hooks to secondary wire of the other, - (not the one to ground) The 2nd cable then becomes the final increased voltage output. The second secondary is an added on secondary winding so as both together becomes a longer wire. Make sure the 2nd unit is facing the right way- there is notation embedded in the epoxy as direction. The pre 1982 Magneto has exposed 4 wires as primary and secondary. -- No embedded solid state trigger. Most ignition coils are called autotransformers with 3 terminals only. (primary hooked internal to secondary) Used armatures- Magnetos and Magnetrons on Ebay for sale.
The other method is to add 12v battery to the "tab" terminal , as part of primary side. The Briggs trigger built in will then short 12v instead of 5-8volts, and release higher than -130 volts to run the secondary side. The Tab terminal is normally on the underneath side of ignition coil as a shut down terminal for the lawn mower. By raising up the primary volts, the Back EMF generated by the shorting, will develop a higher secondary volts to run spark plug. Use diode in series with capacitor with 2nd capacitor hooked to ground. The charged cap will discharge it's voltage into the primary side as the overriding higher volts, than what the magnet induced.
Third method to get higher ignition volts is to add on another complete Magnetron to other side of flywheel activated by the same flywheel magnet. Output energy stored in blue 30KV capacitor that would be put in series with the regular output cable. (2 batteries in series has voltages added together) Extra spark gap needed so as no premature firing of plug. There would be 2 values of gap distances, since cap not wanted to fire until regular spark occurs. The total spark volts is divided up between the 2 spark gaps. 66% of rotating flywheel magnet is unused, useful energy.. -
#15 · date not recorded
Steve, -- The mower ignition coil has a lower high voltage output than car engines. I was collecting data on various means to increase this. The unusual modification of upside down old style armature magneto, (not magnetron), allows for positive high volts , but at a lowered level, since they are all type called autotransformer, with 3 terminals. I noticed on the modern Harley motorcycles the ignition coil was different. I purchased one $50, and examined it. The transformer secondary side is not connected to anything. Later, I found out the Briggs dual spark plug engines have either single or dual ignition Magnetrons. I purchased samples of the one with dual cables. One side cylinder fires negative high volts, and the other fires positive high volts. This is the best method to obtain positive only high volts ignition., at highest volts.without loss. One side hooks to ground.
Back in 2008, there was a circuit on Internet called the capacitor70 circuit for several purposes. I had the idea this was incorporated in the set up of 2008 You tube videos called S1R9A9M9 to enhance the process of running mower engine on water to hydrogen and electrified water vapor pressure as polarized molecules repulsion, pushing piston. The Cap70 circuit is similar to a C.D.I with PF capacitors firing separate primary of step up FERRITE TOROID transformer to increase high volts of car/ mower engine. Ferrite can saturate and has to be designed properly. Ignition is very low current flow and low duty cycle, and core should work. This also isolates the grounds of ignition and added power supply. The circuit however allows high volts to go through the low volts full wave rectifier to get to the spark plug. Not a good idea. I suspected circuit was used in the S1R9A9M9 successful video demonstrations. 2 people indicated it worked. I am presently hooking up to try this on parts and UU ferrite core set mounted on wooden board. U cores are easier to wind, and have the same proper full contained flux path., not like open rod core. 500-1000PF , several caps in series with total voltage tolerance and ferrite core 1:3 step up windings. Resonance of L + C high frequency runs secondary side wound with #16 gauge ignition cable. Experimenters have to keep the grounds separate of the Inverter + ignition, and battery ground. I did a lot of study research before buying parts. Minimum 24KV and pulse peak 7 amps required ,- not average amps. -
#16 · date not recorded
On another note,.....The Briggs brand lawn mower ignition coils have one for a 2 cyl. engine. Those engines DO use either 1 or 2 ignition coils for twin cylinders. I found out , that the dual cables type, single Magnetron coil, is NOT An "autotransformer." The autotransformer has 3 terminals only. The special dual cables type Magnetron has no connection to the PRIMARY side. THEREFORE, 4 TERMINALS SEPARATE. You can put one secondary cable to ground and then get FULL POSITIVE HIGH VOLTS OUT! This is a pulse output circuit, not an AC circuit. Conversion fuel circuits wotk better using positive high volts through spark plug to negative ground. -
#17 ·
I ran across recently a statement made by Nathren long time back, in Georgia, from the shut down tech web forum. It was a reference to the use of very mini Tesla Coil in conjunction with the Briggs engine Magnetron ignition. This would provide Radiant Energy, and increased voltage to spark plug. The old forum said that the technicians noted a higher voltage on the lawn mower running engine than the conversions done on car engines. for water to Hydrogen spark plug electrolysis with resulting self running from the 12 alternator magnets. 2005-2008.
No core miniature air core wire wound forms were called Color TV Delay Lines ,- magnet wire on cardboard tube or the smaller radio coil RF inductors. The R.E. would be and aid to the conversion. -
#18 ·
It all looks so simple, is it? All components are are badly made. How could that ever do something?I finally found a reference on how to increase ignition high volts, quite easily, like Nathren-S1R9A9M9 did, from lawn mower Magnetron output. Data is from 2008, where poster Capacitor70 placed several notes regarding the method. It has to do with adding in 3 capacitors and firing a mounted ADJUSTABLE TYPE SPARK PLUG TESTER The wiring hooks to a 2 1/4" Diam gray ferrite torroid core FT240-31 as step up transformer with 8 + 24 turns. The secondary side hooks to the main spark plug, and also the additional power supply amps. The transformer wires should be insulated high voltage silicone cables. I am using white 30kv and red 30kv. Winding directions polarity have to be figured. (Automotive ignitions are usually quite high in volts, contrary to lawn mower engine's Magnetron). A Briggs Magnetron is a pre1982 Magneto with a solid state trigger module epoxied in, and is all a one-piece unit. Total capacitance in series as less than 1000pf at 6kv to 24kv total. Has to do with speed of resonance of Primary L and C. Suggested use was 2200pf+3900pf+7500pf. Use electronics formula for capacitors in series. The transformer will work for both negative and positive high voltage. While High V is going, must slowly adjust the first gap, to get the second gap to fire. EAY purchase orders less costly than Amazon that has minimum $35 order for no shipping charge. Some separate electronics companies have a minimum dollar order plus shipping plus sales tax. Someone back at that time had converted a Volvo 4cyl car engine to water, using the toroid method. Capacitor70 converted 3 different motorcycle engines that ran on water in carbs.HE said the new method was better than string of series diodes that overheats and melts the solder joints. (I don't see this toroid as any protection for main power supply.) He said there is an isolation factor. I also don't really believe it was just coincidence that the (2) S1R engine demonstrations came out in the same time summer 2008 as the capacitor70 tech data! Several drawings on Internet are wrong for the spark plug hook up for capacitor70 circuit. SEE THE ACTUAL TOROID CORE PICTURE FOR ORIGINAL USED AS GREEN WIRE HOOKED TO ACCESSORY FIRST SPARK PLUG TOP! The higher turns brown magnet wire is secondary step up as volts 1:3. The secondary side should hook to spark plug top and ground, CONTRARY TO THE OTHER INTERNET DRAWINGS. The circuit will allow for PLASMA PATH for the following amps injection.See other notes about the S1Rcoils as an actual hand wound step down transformer ratio 13:7, to use the low amps pulsing DC from output of dual alternators ring, to raise it up to flow the 10amps as stated., when only at idling RPM. The 7 turns wound same way as 13 turns, requires the steel nail/screw core underneath for proper magnetic field. The exterior extension cord that's split in the videos, allows connection to ground exactly at spark plug ground. Ground point same as for both 1st spark gap and tap to ground for S1R coils.The elecromagnet also provides the needed field that EXTENDS the spark time - slows it down from 0 to to minus 34 degrees proper late timing. A separate coil L of about 1.75 Millihenry is also in the high voltage line for further time extension. (Car battery first allows current, then removed.) The plastic sealed deli tub on side of Briggs engine contained BOTH the S1r coils assembly + the step up high voltage pulse transformer with spark gap and capacitors. Nathren had said there were no capacitors used. He was untrained and ignorant, and was thinking about CONDENSERS - the old wording. The three actual technicians in Georgia workshop designed and built all the circuits,- not him. He said so. All this has to do with electrolysis at spark plug for hydrogen gas and water vapor pressure for self running engine, as was shown on Youtube video - S1R9A9M9 (2) videos and Nathren's now shut down web forum.
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#19 · date not recorded
Most people have not spent the time + effort in studying an electrical topic. You missed the point. The Briggs one cylinder engine has preset timing at factory at T.D.C. The use of Hydrogen gas as fuel requires change to late timing ATDC. The 3 wires coil called the S1R9A9M9 forms magnetic field over the PLUG WIRE , so as causing extension of time of original spark as to neg 34 degrees. This was explained many times in my past statements. Readers have to grasp this. In the 2 videos of 2008, the battery supplied power for the conversion circuit to START ONLY, until up to idle speed. Then the self running alternator provided about 15 amps to run inverter box and the electromagnet. Spark plug electrolysis and some minor water vapor as pressure. The vapor forms because of the downward piston in state as lowered compression and VOLATILE vapor. (Vacuum area) It gets polarized charge and molecules repel each other as pressure generated. Data was later shut down on web forum due to others getting hurt attempting replications. . Got it now?
The Capacitor 70 circuit set up was poor, as running high volts through the low volts bridge rectifier, no reference to step up of volts as with turns ratio, no part number exact for ferrite piece, and no general information to get the transformer working. He said there was electrical isolation, - but not with the bridge. I had assumed an increase in ignition volts, but not there.His motorcycle engine running on water had melting solder on the whole diodes bank. . The transformer was to eliminate diodes. That was not an established technician, just a common low quality tinkerer.
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